Frederick Guthrie & Mollie Louallen

The Family Focus is on . . .

FREDERICK GUTHRIE & MOLLIE LOUALLEN
~ North Carolina to South Carolina ~

Let’s take a closer look at Thicketty Creek, South Carolina and the family of Frederick Guthrie and Mary ‘Mollie’ Louallen. Key locales for this lineage include Edgecombe & Rutherford Counties, North Carolina, Spartanburg County, South Carolina, White & Pulaski Counties, Arkansas, and Henderson County, Texas.

Family Focus write ups include Origin Theories, Mistaken Identities, Family History and Documentation, Analysis of YDNA & Autosomal DNA results, and a summary with some Conclusions and Recommendations. You are encouraged to discuss the content, add historical data and sources, argue theories or present your own.

These Guthries and others residing in the area of Thicketty Creek, SC are presumed to be interrelated, but there is no documented proof of their exact familial connections nor are there any ties to one of the DNA project’s established Guthrie Family Groups. We need some Guthrie Y-DNA from a direct male descendant of Frederick and Mollie’s line to conclusively prove a Guthrie Family Group connection.

Fortunately, this family has participants in the Family Finder / Autosomal DNA portion of the project, so there is data for comparison. The Carolinas are a common settlement spot for several unrelated Guthrie Family Groups, which means there will likely be a mix of matches to cousins who happen to have other Guthrie ancestry.

Some have attempted to link this Guthrie line to Guthrie Family Group 1A, the Guthries of Middlesex County, Virginia as one of their branches ends up in Spartanburg, SC by 1820. Guthrie Family Group 5 also has potential as the origin for the Guthrie-Louallen family. The given names Shadrick and Matthew, both found in Thicketty Creek, are also in one of the confirmed GFG5 lineages. Regional connections in the NC/SC area are also present in multiple branches of Guthrie Family Groups 2A, as well as GFG9 and the Ungrouped families are also found in Carteret, NC, which potentially belong to GFG5. The autosomal DNA results may provide clues as to the origins of this family.

Take this opportunity to add details to the collected documentation for the Guthrie-Louallen line, suggest corrections, discuss current theories, and develop new ones.




Origin Theories:

According to Frederick Guthrie’s testimony on his Revolutionary War Pension Application, he was born in 1763 in Edgecombe County, North Carolina. At the time of his military service, Frederick lived in Rutherford County, North Carolina, and then eventually moved to Spartanburg, South Carolina after the war. These are the facts. Theory comes into play in trying to determine his ancestral origins.

Most online trees do not list any set of parents, which is probably the most accurate option at the moment as there does not seem to be any proof of their identity. First, let’s look for clues in online trees, early records, naming patterns, and common residences to see if any light can be shed on the identities of Frederick’s parents. Next, we’ll review the Autosomal DNA results of Guthrie DNA Project members who descend from Frederick and Mollie (Louallen) Guthrie.

There is at least one tree listing Absalom Guthrie (1776NC-1836SC) & Rebecca Allen. Absalom is a descendant of GFG1A as proven by Y-DNA testing of a direct male descendant. He lived in Caswell & Person Counties during his early life, and then was in Union, SC by 1810, and Spartanburg, SC by 1820. By this time, Frederick Guthrie was already living there for about 30-40 years. Seemingly, the only connection between Absalom and Frederick is their residence in Spartanburg County. Chances are that Absolom’s presence in Spartanburg is a coincidence, but YDNA testing of Frederick’s line would conclusively prove a GFG1A connection or rule it out.

Frederick had been living in Spartanburg District, SC since the 1780s. In 1800 he received 1/2 of a 200 acre property on Thicketty Creek originally granted to Matthew Guttry in 1786. This single document reveals the potential for family connections. The other half of the property went to Joseph Price (a possible brother-in-law), and witnesses included Frederick Guthrie, Shadrick Guttry, and William Hearn. Signed by Matthew Guttry & Elizabeth Guttry.

There were already Guthrie families in the area of Thicketty Creek since the 1750s. On 9 Sep 1752 two families had gathered at the home of John Gutrey to celebrate a wedding when the Shawnee attacked. Sixteen people were killed and ten went missing. Buffalo Creek and Thicketty Creek are in close proximity to each other, and the massacre is described as being in both locations.

Did Frederick Guthrie settle in an area already occupied by relatives? Or were there unrelated Guthries already there? Property documents suggest that some of them were family members.

  • John Guthrie – died in massacre in 1753 (Before Frederick’s birth)
  • Matthew & Elizabeth Guthrie – Gave/Sold 1/2 Land to Frederick
  • Shadrick Guthrie – witness to property records with Matthew
  • Ann Guthrie aka Nicey married Joseph Price – Got the other 1/2 Land
  • William Guthrie – Admin of Frederick’s estate

Another potential genetic clue to which Y-DNA should solve or Autosomal DNA provide some clues is the connection of the above mentioned Shadrick Guthrie. He disappears from SC for parts unknown at the same time as Matthew Guthrie. Shadrick could potentially be the same man who married Malinda Badley & Ruah Ann Roberts. His youngest son with Malinda was named Matthew Guthrie.  This family is represented in the Y-DNA project by 2 participants, via a son descending from each wife, which matches Guthrie Family Group 5. 



Family of Frederick Guthrie & Mary ‘Mollie’ Louallen:

FREDERICK GUTHRIE
Born:
1763
Location: Edgecombe County, North Carolina, USA
Married: Mary Louallen about 1788 presumably in South Carolina, USA
Occupation: Planter/Farmer, presumably
Military Service: Revolutionary War
Died: About 1848
Location: Spartanburg County, South Carolina, USA
Buried: Spartanburg County, South Carolina, USA, presumably


MARY ‘MOLLIE’ LOUALLEN
Born:
About 1771
Location: South Carolina
Children: 11
Sons: Jonathan (1791), Matthew (1794), Samuel (1796), Joseph (1803), Edmund Matthew (1806), Ephraim W (1810)
Daughters: Rebecca (1789), Mary (1798), Martha (1800), Margaret (1807), Nancy (1813)
Died: 1 July 1861
Location: Spartanburg County, South Carolina, USA
Buried: Spartanburg County, South Carolina, USA, presumably


CHILDREN:

REBECCA GUTHRIE
1789SC-1848AR

Rebecca Guthrie was born in SC on 26 August 1789. She married James Eldridge Fergusuon with whom she had 8 sons and 1 daughter: William (1807), Frederick Guthrie (1809), Malinda (1811), Joseph Gaines (1814), Andrew Jackson (1815), James Eldridge (1824), Franklin Marion (1826), Wesley Green (1829), and Edmond Deskon James (1832). This family lived in Pulaski, Arkansas. James died 18 April 1847 in MS. Rebecca died on 24 Oct 1848 in AR.

Family Finder / Autosomal DNA Participants: No


JONATHAN GUTHRIE
1791SC-1847AR

Jonathan was born about 1791 in South Carolina. At the age of 16 he and his father Frederick witnessed a deed between Patrick Sanders Jr to James Ferguson, the latter being the husband of Rebecca Guthrie (above).

The name Jonathan Guthrie/Guttary/Guttery is found at Fold3 for the War of 1812 Service Records. He served as a private in 1 Regt. (Means’) South Carolina Militia.

Jonathan Guthrie was a church founder and lay minister at Macedonia Baptist Church, part of the Broad River Baptist Association. His brother Samuel Guthrie had deeded a parcel of land on which the church built its first log structure. He became ordained as a Minister of the Gospel in 1822 and continued to preach for the community until about 1830. At that time there was some discord between Rev. Guthrie, his parishioners, and the association. He was accused of disruptive behavior and measures were taken to depose him from his position as minister. The local churches that were members of the association were advised to refuse him.

Jonathan Guthrie and his family were enumerated in Rutherford County, NC in 1830, just across the state line from Spartanburg, SC. He received a land grant in Rutherford County, NC on the South Side of the Main Broad River on 18 December 1830.

These marriage notices were found in the ‘North Carolina Spectator‘:
Friday, 23 Apr 1830: MARRIED–A few weeks since near Thickety mountain, by the Rev. Jonathan Guthrie, Mrs George Hamrick of this County, to Mrs Ann Wright, of Spartanburg District, SC. Near the Cowpens, in Spartanburg District, a few days since, by the same, Mr Pelly Reynolds of this county, to Miss Cynthia Williams, of Spartanburg District, SC.–Also, by the same, Mr John M Hicks, of this county, to Miss Elizabeth Dobbins, of Spartanburg District, SC.

Friday, 29 Oct 1830: MARRIED–In this county on the 30th ult. by Rev Jonathan Guthrie, Mr Zebidee Cantrul of Spartanburg, SC to Miss Frances, daughter of the late Philip Davis.

Jonathan Guthrie married in the Carolinas around 1809, probably in either Rutherford, NC or in Spartanburg, SC. The wife with whom he presumably had 4 sons and 6 daughters is believed to be Nancy (MNU). She is identified a widowed head of household in the 1850 census of White, AR. The children are enumerated in Rutherford, NC (1830) and Pulaski, AR (1840) records. Most remain unidentified. The eldest son was likely Joseph Guthrie (1810-1855) who married 1st Sarah Jones, and 2nd Ann Thomas. Only 2 other children are known: Eliza (1833) and Mary (1836). Jonathan died a year before his father in 1847. Frederick Guthrie’s estate shows a distribution to the heirs of Jonathan Guthrie, decd.

Y-DNA Project Participants: No
Family Finder / Autosomal DNA Participants: No


MATTHEW GUTHRIE
1794SC-1874GA

Matthew Guthrie was born on 10 January 1794. He married Nancy Dewberry around 1833. There is no indication in the records that this is a second marriage, so it appears that he simply took his time in taking a wife. They had 9 children: James (1834), Frederick Lovic (1836), Mary (1838), Nancy P (1840), Julia A (1841), Susan (1843) Samuel (1845), Sarah Margaret (1846), and Edward / Edmond (1848). The family moved to Cass County, GA by 1850, but also lived in Carroll and Campbell Counties. Matthew died on 1 October 1874 and is buried at Fairburn, Fulton, GA. Nancy died in 1883.

Y-DNA Project Participants: No
Family Finder / Autosomal DNA Participants: Yes


SAMUEL GUTHRIE
1796SC-1857AR

Samuel Guthrie was born about 1796 in South Carolina. His first marriage was to Mariah Jarrett  about 1822. They had 7 children: Franklin W (1823), Calvin (1825), Frances (1827), Sarah (1833), Samuel (1839), William Harrison (1840), and Mariah (1843).  Mariah died in 1843 and Samuel remarried on 28 August 1845 in White, AR to Juliette Howerton. They divorced. Samuel married a third time to Mrs Charity (MNU) Moss on 14 Mar 1848. No children for the last 2 marriages.

Samuel Guthrie became the first county judge for White County, Arkansas. He held four sessions of court per year and received a salary of but $50/year. While he held court at Searcy, he made his home at Clearwater, and in addition to serving in public office he engaged extensively in farming, remaining in White Co. to the time of his death. [Source]

Y-DNA Project Participants: No
Family Finder / Autosomal DNA Participants: No


MARY ‘POLLY’ GUTHRIE
1798SC-1850AR

Polly was born about on 16 Sep 1798. She married John Dunaway on 15 March 1815 in Spartanburg. They had 8 children: Lucinda (1817), Arlinda (1820), William (1822), Frederick (1825), Martha (1827), Sinia (1829), Edward (1830), Mary (1833). Polly died in 1850 prior to her husband.

Family Finder / Autosomal DNA Participants: No


MARTHA GUTHRIE
1800SC-1875SC

Martha Guthrie was born about 1800. She married John Thomas. They remained in South Carolina. Online trees list them with 3 daughters: Mary (1832), Margaret Mahala (18??), and Amanda M. (18??). Martha reportedly died before 1880 in SC.


JOSEPH GUTHRIE
1803SC-1848AR

Joseph Guthrie was born about 1803. His marriage to Susannah Wood took place about 1822, and they had 7 children: Mary Martha (1823), Nelson M (1829), Martha (1829), Edmond G (1832), Fredrick H (1836), Fielding (1837) and Michael Owen (1840). Sometime between 1830 and 1836, Joseph moved his family to Pulaski, Arkansas. Two years later they settled in White County, Arkansas where some of his brothers had also taken up residence. Joseph died about 1848 and Susannah in 1858.


EDMUND MATTHEW GUTHRIE
1806SC-1873TX

The records for Edmund and Ephraim still confuse me because their initials and ages seem to switch back and forth so that one brother appears to belong to the opposite family. Maybe their descendants can help me straighten this out. 

Edmund Matthew Guthrie, frequently noted in the records as EM, was born in South Carolina sometime between 1791-1810, probably around 1806 according to online trees. He was living with his parents in 1810 in Spartanburg, presumably one of the 3M under 10 in the household, which puts his age range in the 1801-1810 category. He is with his parents in Spartanburg in 1820 listed as 1M 10-15 (1805-1810). I’m not sure where he’s at in 1830. Could be the 1M 20-29 (1801-1810) living with his parents, or that could be younger brother Ephraim. 

Edmund had settled in White County, AR by 1840 where he is listed in the 40-49 age category. Should be 30-39. The only other person in the household is a female age 20-29, presumably a wife. By 1850 Edmund and Ephraim moved to Henderson County, TX where the census records seem to have switched their initials E M and EW for the wrong families, and listed them as the same age, 40. The man who should be Edmund is living with Nancy, 36, presumably his wife (or his widowed sister-in-law), and several others, including a Calvin Guthrie, 19. His listing indicates that he is not a son of Edmund and Nancy, but simply a household member. Likely a son of brother Jonathan who died in 1847. Edmund was appointed as the postmaster of Buffalo, Henderson, TX on 10 Nov 1869. He and Nancy were living there in 1860 and listed with several others including an Edmund Guthrie, 15, presumably another of his brother Jonathan’s sons.

His wife (or sister-in-law) Nancy must have died sometime between 1860-1864, or they divorced. Edmund married Harriett E Newman in Henderson County, TX on 7 August 1864. They had 2 children: Mary Sinia (1867) and Edmund Matthew (Jan 1870). Harriett died in February 1870 of puerperal fever within a short time of her son’s birth.

With 2 young children, Edmund may have remarried again to Mary Elizabeth ‘Lizzie’ Guthrie on 4 Dec 1871 in Henderson, TX. She was the widow of his (probable) nephew, Andrew Jackson Guthrie (1834-1863).

His mother’s 1861 obituary states that Edmond ‘had both legs amputated; but when last heard from was a wealthy planter in Texas.’

According to online trees, Edmund died about 1873 in Henderson, TX. I cannot find any source data for that date. His widow Lizzie died in June 1877. In 1880, Edmund’s daughter Mary is found living in Kaufman County, TX with the family of Samuel Harman Guthrie (son of Ephraim W Guthrie, below), listed as a cousin. Son Matthew is listed as an orphan on the 1880 census where he is living in Brown County, TX with James Guthrie and family.

Y-DNA Project Participants: No
Family Finder / Autosomal DNA Participants: No


MARGARET GUTHRIE
1807SC-1864AR

Margaret was born on 24 August 1807 in South Carolina. She married Joel George Wood about 1827. They moved to White County, Arkansas. Children: Calvin (1828), Terry (1830), Calender (1831), James Prince Otis (1832), Jason (1834), Christopher Columbus (1837), Martha Harriett (1844), Ava (1846), Joel Abraham (18??). Margaret died on 20 April 1864 four years after the death of her husband.

Family Finder / Autosomal DNA Participants: No


EPHRAIM W GUTHRIE
1810SC-1868TX

Ephraim W Guthrie was born in South Carolina. He was living in his parents’ household in Spartanburg through the 1820 or 1830 census. He married Sinai / Sinia Covey on 16 August 1836 in Pulaski County, Arkansas and showed up on a Tax List for the county that same year. He was appointed a US Postmaster on 8 March 1837 in Frankfort, White, AR. The 1840 census of White, AR lists E W Guthrie 1M 30-39, 1M & 1F20-29, 2M under 5. Ephraim and Sinia had 3 sons and a daughter: John Cisco (1837), James Thomas (1840), Rachel (1842), and Samuel Harman (1844). They moved to Henderson County, TX between 1840-1850, and then Kaufman County, TX by 1860. Ephraim died there about June 1868 per online trees. His wife Sinia died 21 April 1871 and is buried in Henderson County at Guthrie Cemetery.

Y-DNA Project Participants: No
Family Finder / Autosomal DNA Participants: No


NANCY GUTHRIE
1813SC-18??

Nancy Guthrie was born in Spartanburg, SC. She married Alfred Dewberry. about 1832 in Cowpens, Spartanburg, SC. They had 4 sons: Felix (1833), Peyton (1838), John Miles (1843), and James (1844). Alfred died in 1861. Nancy’s DOD is unknown.

Family Finder / Autosomal DNA Participants: No



Documented Family History / Historical Highlights:

1712: COLONIAL NORTH and SOUTH CAROLINA

1721:  CHEROKEE NATION CEDES LAND
The Cherokee Nation ceded lands to the British in  1721. The earliest villages in the area were Cherokee and Catawba Indian Nations.

1754: SHAWNEEE MASSACRE at BUFFALO / THICKETY CREEK
Ninety-Six District, South Carolina about September 1754 (alt.1756)

“Even more alarming (than growing unrest between the Cherokee and SC traders) was the uneasiness among the Overhill towns because of their exposure to the attacks of the Shawnee or ‘French Indians’.” The author describes a massacre: “The danger in this situation was brought nearer home by the murder in September 1754 of the families of JOHN GUTTERY and a neighbor and of several travelers, in all sixteen or seventeen. This occurred on Buffalo creek, near the border of North and South Carolina as later surveyed, but them supposed to be in the northern province. The bodies, piles with hogs and fowls killed by the Indians were found by a couple who had gone forty miles to be married and were returning to the waiting Guttery household. The panic-stricken discoverers remained only long enough to throw the bodies in a well.” [The Expansion of South Carolina – by Robert Lee Meriwether]

Another source lists the following placing the location in NC and blaming the Cherokee rather than the Shawnee.

“Buffalo Creek, NC; Massacre. In September 1753, a band of raiders, believed to have been Cherokees, attacked a settlement on Buffalo Creek, North Carolina. They killed 17 members of the James Anshers and john Gutrey families and carried ten others into captivity. (Douglas L Rights, The American Indian in North Carolina.)” [Handbook of the American Frontier – by Joseph Norman Heard]

The Gaffney Ledger
‘The Cherokee County Story”
17 March 2004

1763: BIRTH of FREDERICK GUTHRIE
Edgecombe County, North Carolina

Edgecombe County was established 4 April 1741 from Bertie County. There is no known history of courthouse disasters in this county resulting in any major loss of county records.

1769: FORMATION of NINETY-SIX DISTRICT, SOUTH CAROLINA
South Carolina on 29 July 1769

Ninety-Six District was created on 29 July 1769 as the most western of the seven original districts within the Province of South Carolina. Its boundaries included the current Abbeville, McCormick, Edgefield, Saluda, Greenwood, Laurens, Union, and Spartanburg counties; much of Cherokee and Newberry counties; and small parts of Aiken and Greenville Counties. The lands further west were Cherokee Indian lands barred to colonial settlers (but not to traders nor travellers) since the Royal Proclamation of 1763. 

1771: BIRTH OF MARY ‘MOLLIE’ LOUALLEN
South Carolina, about 1771

Mary Louallen Guthrie’s obituary indicates that she was living in or very near Cherokee County, SC as a young girl. The county was not formed until 1897 from parts of York, Spartanburg, and Union Counties.

Online trees list her parents as a (FNU) Louallen / Lewellin (d. 17 Jan 1781 Battle of Cowpens) and Elizabeth Ann Barnett. Mollie’s father was mistaken for a Tories and was killed.

“Joe Price was Molly’s stepfather. Joe Price was a Dutch descendant. He came over here and settled in Maryland.  War came up he was a Soldier in the army at Cowpens Battle grown  He got wounded, shot through the thigh.  He came down to what we call the fork of branches at the foot of Thickety Mountain, to Lou Allen’s house that was close by and stayed there and nursed his leg until it healed.” Apparently Joe ended up marrying Molly’s widowed mother.
[Email by 4xGGF of Joe Price to Christina Morrow]

1777-1778: VOLUNTEER SERVICE

Frederick Guthrie testified that he served as a volunteer soldier for a term of three and a half months of a six month term at Seneca Fort at a stream then called Savannah. He believes the year was 1777 or 1778. Served under Capt Richard Tutt. He had been given permission to go home for a time and while he was away the fort was taken by the British and Tories, so he did not return. He was also drafted to go to a place called Cross Creek serving there 8 days, and then to Britton Meeting House in Rutherford County NC in guarding prisoners.

1779: FORMATION of RUTHERFORD COUNTY, NC
Tyron County, North Carolina, USA

Rutherford County was created from Tryon and Tryon was abolished.

The Rutherford County Courthouse burned in 1907 sustaining record losses.

1780: REVOLUTIONARY WAR ENGAGMENT at THICKETTY FORT
Ninety-Six District (Present Day Cherokee County) on 26 July 1780

Thicketty Fort was aka Rocky Ford and Fort Anderson. A Patriot force arrived at the Loyalist garrison commanded by Capt Patrick Moore. “The Patriots pursuaded the garrison to surrender, including one British Sergeant Major who was assigned to train Loyalists, without firing a shot. They also captured 250 loaded muskets.” Soldiers named include William Hearn, who shows up in Guthrie property records as a witness.
[The American Revolution in South Carolina]

I do not find any mention of this engagement documented in Frederick Guthrie’s Rev War Pension Application record, but by his own estimated arrival to the area in 1777 or 1778, he was probably in the district if not the in the Thickety Creek area.

Frederick was in the Rutherford County Regiment. First in SC unit. 1780, a Private under Capt. Jacob Vanzant and Lt. Col. John Earle. Mostly stationed at Earle’s Ford, SC. Born in 1763 in Edgecombe County, NC. 
[The American Revolution in North Carolina]

1780-1781: MILITARY SERVICE in REVOLUTIONARY WAR

Rutherford County, NC – Captain Jacob Vinzant, Colonel John Earle.
Drafted for a tour of three months and stationed at Earle’s Station and Nebbit’s Station.
Sent home at the end of his tour, but without any regular discharge papers
He was drafted and served a tour of 10 (?) days in the same county under the same commanding officers.

1781: REVOLUTIONARY WAR – THE BATTLE of COWPENS
South Carolina on 17 January 1781

“The Battle of Cowpens was fought on January 17, 1781, near Thicketty Creek, South Carolina, on a 500 square yard grazing pasture. It began shortly after dawn on a bitterly cold morning and resulted in a devastating defeat for the British army, ending a brief string of victories for the Crown in the southern colonies.” [Washington Library – Battle of Cowpens]

~also~

“The Battle of Cowpens was an engagement during the American Revolutionary War fought on January 17, 1781, between American Colonial forces under Brigadier General Daniel Morgan and British forces under Lieutenant Colonel Sir Banastre Tarleton, as part of the campaign in the Carolinas (North and South). The battle was a turning point in the American reconquest of South Carolina from the British.”

“Tarleton’s brigade was wiped out as an effective fighting force, and, coupled with the British defeat at the Battle of Kings Mountain in the northwest corner of South Carolina, this action compelled Cornwallis to pursue the main southern American army into North Carolina, leading to the Battle of Guilford Court House, and Cornwallis’s eventual defeat at the Siege of Yorktown in Virginia in October 1781.”
[Wikipedia – Battle of Cowpens]

1784: LAND WARRANT
Ninety-Six District, South Carolina, USA on 9 August 1784

Warrant from John Thomas Esq. Comissioner of Locations -Matthew GUTREY a tract of land containing 200 acres situate 96 Dist East of old boundary on both sides of Thickerty creek of Broad River bounded all sides by vacant land.

1785: SUBDIVISION of SOUTH CAROLINA DISTRICTS

“As a result of the 1785 Act, districts in South Carolina were further subdivided into counties. These counties were responsible for maintaining court houses, as part of the larger judicial districts from which they were formed. The Ninety-Six District was given the counties of Abbeville, Edgefield, Laurens, Newberry, Spartanburg, and Union.” [Wikipedia]

1789: BIRTH of DAUGHTER – REBECCA GUTHRIE
Spartanburg County, South Carolina, USA on 26 August 1789

1790: US CENSUS of SOUTH CAROLINA
Spartanburg County, South Carolina, USA

Captain Philip Martin’s District includes: Sarah Price0-0-2, Joseph Turner 1-4-4, Frederic Gillbevry (Guttery?) 2-0-3, and Matthew Gulkney (Guttery?) 1-2-5, Joseph Price 2-2-4.

1791: NINETY-SIX DISTRICT LAND ACQUIRED BY PINKNEY DISTRICT
On 19 February 1791, the Ninety-Six District lost the land in the current Union, Spartanburg counties and the portion of Cherokee county within the district in the formation of Pinckney District.

1791: BIRTH of SON – JONATHAN GUTHRIE
Spartanburg County, South Carolina, USA about 1791

1794: BIRTH of SON – MATTHEW GUTHRIE
Spartanburg County, South Carolina, USA on 10 January 1794

1794: COUNTY COURT MINUTES
Spartanburg County, South Carolina on Monday, 2 April 1794

Ordered that Matthew Guttery oversee the road from Gentl. Thomson’s to said Gutrys Mill, in place of JOSEPH PRICE all his (sic) within three miles of the same to work thereon under his direction.(Spartanburg County SC Minutes of the County Court, 1785 – 199 by Brent H. Holcomb)

1795: PROPERTY CONVEYANCE – HEARNE to PRICE
Spartanburg County, South Carolina on 7 February 1795

Lucy Hearne to Joseph Price of 18 pds sterling sold 120a on branch of Thickety Creek. Witnesses Matthew Gutery, Shadrach Gutery, and John Proctor. (Spartanburg County/District SC Deeds Abstracts Books A-T 1785-1827, by Albert Bruice Pruitt)

1796: BIRTH of SON – SAMUEL GUTHRIE
Spartanburg County, South Carolina, USA about 1796

1800: BIRTH of DAUGHTER – MARTHA GUTHRIE
Spartanburg County, South Carolina, USA about 1800

1800: PROPERTY CONVEYANCE – GUTTRY to GUTTRY & PRICE

Frederick Guttry received 1/2 of a 200a property on Thickety Cr originally granted to Matthew Guttry. Other 1//2 to Joseph Price. Wit: Frederick Guttry, Shamrock Guttry, Wm Hearn. Signed Matthew Guttry & Elizabeth Guttry.

1800: US CENSUS of SOUTH CAROLINA
Spartanburg District, South Carolina

FREDERICK GUTERY HOUSEHOLD: 1F 45+, 1M & 1F 26-44, 1F 10-15, 3M & 3F Under 10. Total – 10. Neighbors include Hearn and Price.

This is the only Guthrie household for Spartanburg in 1800. It is as if Matthew Guthrie conveyed his property and immediately left the area, assuming that he was not already gone. Same goes for the witnesses Frederick Guttry and Shamrock (Shadrick) Guttry.

1803: BIRTH of SON – JOSEPH GUTHRIE
Spartanburg County, South Carolina, USA about 1803

1804: BIRTH of DAUGHTER – MARY ‘POLLY’ GUTHRIE
Spartanburg County, South Carolina, USA about 1804

1805-1806: MARRIAGE of DAUGHTER – REBECCA GUTHRIE
Spartanburg County, South Carolina, USA, presumably

Rebecca Guthrie married James Eldridge Ferguson, presumably about 1805-1806 prior to the birth of their first child in Spartanburg County, South Carolina. They would become parents to 9 children:
– William Ferguson (1807-1845)
– Frederick Guthrie Ferguson (1809-1856)
– Malinda Ferguson (1811-1822)
– Joseph Gaines Ferguson (1814-1836)
– Andrew Jackson Ferguson (1815-1855)
– James Eldridge Ferguson (1824-1876)
– Franklin Marion Ferguson (1826-1849)
– Wesley Green Ferguson (1829-1868)
– Edmond Deskon James Ferguson (1832-1858)

1806: BIRTH of SON – EDMUND MATTHEW GUTHRIE
Spartanburg County, South Carolina, USA about 1806

1807: BIRTH of DAUGHTER – MARGARET GUTHRIE
Spartanburg County, South Carolina, USA on 24 August 1807

1810: BIRTH of SON – EPHRIAM W GUTHRIE
Spartanburg County, South Carolina, USA about 1810

1810: US CENSUS of SOUTH CAROLINA
Spartanburg County, South Carolina on 7 August 1820

This is the only Guthrie household for Spartanburg in 1810.

FRED GUTTERRY HOUSEHOLD: 1M 45+, 1F 26-44, 1M 16-25, 1M & 2F 10-15, 3M & 2F under 10.

1810-1817: MARRIAGE of SON – JONATHAN GUTHRIE
Spartanburg County, South Carolina, presumably between 1810 – 1817

Jonathan Guthrie is believed to have married a woman by the name of Nancy whose maiden name remains unknown. The marriage most likely occurred in either Rutherford County, NC or Spartanburg County, SC. Census enumerations in 1830 and 1840 suggest the couple had 10 children.
– Joseph Guthrie (1810-1855)
– Daughter #1 born 1810-1820
– Son #2 born 1811-1815
– Daughter #3 born 1816-1820
– Son #3 born 1821-1825
– Son #4 born 1821-1825
– Daughter #3 born 1826-1830
– Daughter #4 born 1826-1830
– Eliza Guthrie born about 1833
– Mary Guthrie born about 1836

1812: BIRTH of SON/OTHER RELATION – WILLIAM GUTHRIE
Spartanburg County, South Carolina, USA on 9 February 1812

Online trees list William Guthrie as a son of Frederick and Mollie, however I cannot find William listed in records designating them as their son. It does make sense as William Guthrie was designated as Frederick’s estate administrator, however he is not listed as an heir in the petition of 1849.

1813: BIRTH of DAUGHTER – NANCY GUTHRIE
Spartanburg County, South Carolina, USA about 1813

1815: MARRIAGE of DAUGHTER – MARY ‘POLLY’ GUTHRIE
Spartanburg County, South Carolina, USA

Polly Guthrie married John Dunaway on 15 March 1815 in Spartanburg. They had 3 sons and 5 daughters:
– Lucinda Dunaway (1817-1854)
– Arlinda Dunaway (1820-1870)
– William E Dunaway (1822-Unk)
– Frederick Dunaway (1825-Unk)
– Martha D Dunaway (1827-1858)
– Sinia Dunaway (1829-Unk)
– Edward E Dunaway (1830-Unk)
– Mary A Dunaway (1833-Unk)

1820: US CENSUS of SOUTH CAROLINA
Spartanburg, Spartanburg, South Carolina, USA

There are 2 Fred Guttery Households listed:

FRED GUTTERY HOUSEHOLD: 1M & 1F 45+, 1M 16-25, 1M & 1F 10-15, 1M & 1F under 10. Neighbors Penington, Cruise, Wyat, Wilky

FRED GUTTERY HOUSEHOLD: 1M & 1F 45+, 1M16-25, 1M & 1F 10-15, 1M & 1F under 10.
Neighbors Bostick, Campbell, Brock, Webber

The enumerations of both families are exactly the same.

The 1820 census also contains entries for: 

Absm Guttery (Absalom Guthrie & Rebecca Allen) Household
1M & 1F 45 and over
1F 10-15
3M & 3F under 10
3 Slaves: 2M & 1F under 14

Mathias Guttery.
1M & 1F 16-25
1F under 10

About 1822: MARRIAGE of SON – SAMUEL GUTHRIE
Spartanburg County, South Carolina, USA, presumably

Samuel Guthrie was married 3 times. His first marriage about 1822 was to Mariah Jarrett with whom he had 7 children.
– Franklin W Guthrie (1823-1854)
– Calvin Guthrie (1825-1862)
– Frances Guthrie (1827-Unk)
– Sarah Guthrie (1833-Unk)
– Samuel Guthrie (1839-1903)
– William Harrison Guthrie (1840-Unk)
– Mariah Guthrie (1843-Unk)
Mariah died in 1843. No children were born to Samuel’s subsequent marriages to Juliette Howerton (m.28 Aug 1845 in White, AR) and Mrs Charity (MNU) Moss (m. 14 Mar 1848 in White, AR).

About 1822: MARRIAGE of SON – JOSEPH GUTHRIE
Spartanburg County, South Carolina, USA, presumably

Joseph Guthrie married Susannah ‘Susan’ Wood about 1822. They were parents to 2 daughters and 5 sons:
– Mary Martha Guthrie (1823-1893)
– Nelson M Guthrie (1829-1880)
– Martha Guthrie (1829-1870)
– Edmond G Guthrie (1832-1916)
– Frederick H Guthrie (1836-1864)
– Fielding Guthrie (1837-1912)
– Michael Owen Guthrie (1840-1862)

About 1827: MARRIAGE of DAUGHTER – MARGARET GUTHRIE
Spartanburg County, South Carolina, USA, presumably

Margaret Guthrie was married to Joel George Wood about 1827. They had 7 sons and 2 daughters:
– Calvin Wood (1828-Unk)
– Terry Wood (1830-Unk)
– Calendar Wood (1831-Unk)
– James Prince Otis Wood (1832-1920)
– Jason F Wood (1834-1900)
– Christopher Columbus Wood (1837-1925)
– Martha Harriet Wood (1844-1915)
– Ava Wood (1846-1863)
– Joel Abraham Wood (Unk-Unk)

1830: US CENSUS of SOUTH CAROLINA
Spartanburg County, South Carolina, USA

FREDERICK GUTHRIE HOUSEHOLD: 1M & 1F 50-59 (1771-1780); 1M 20-29 (1801-1810); 1F 15-19 (1811-1815); 1M 10-14 (1816-1820). Other county entries for Abraham, E Logan, Joseph, N, Samuel, and Matthew Guthrie. The last three are all sons of Frederick and Mollie.

1833: MARRIAGE of SON / OTHER RELATION – WILLIAM GUTHRIE
Spartanburg County, South Carolina, USA on 30 March 1833

William Guthrie married Clementine Thomas, presumably in Spartanburg. They lived in that county through 1850. By 1860 they were living in Greene County in eastern Tennessee where they remained. Children:
– Martha Guthrie (1834)
– Nancy Guthrie (1835)
– Miriam Guthrie (1839)
– Martin Luther Guthrie (1843)
– Missouri Adeline Guthrie (1845)
– William Thomas Guthrie (1847)
– Lucinda Guthrie (1849)
William Guthrie died in Greene County, TN on 6 August 1883 and is buried at Guthrie Cemetery in Mosheim, Greene, TN. His wife Clementine survived him by ten years.

About 1833: MARRIAGE of SON – MATTHEW GUTHRIE
Spartanburg County South Carolina about 1833, presumably

There is a Matthew Guthrie listed in the 1830 census of Spartanburg aged 30-39 (born 1791-1800) who fits the age criteria for this man. His wife is of the same age range. The household includes 1F 10-14 (1816-1820), 2F 5-9 (1821-1825), and 2M & 2F under 5 (1826-1830). If this is the correct family, none of the children have been identified and attached. The earliest child associated with this family was born about 1832.
– James Guthrie (1834-Unk)
– Frederick Lovic Guthrie (1836-1908)
– Mary Guthrie (1838-Unk)
– Nancy P Guthrie (1840-1925)
– Julia A Guthrie (1841-Unk)
– Susan Guthrie (1843-1891)
– Samuel Guthrie (1845-Unk)
– Sarah Margaret Guthrie (1846-1929)
– Edward / Edmund Guthrie (1848-1886)

1834: JOSEPH PRICE’S WILL
Spartanburg County, South Carolina, USA on 7 May 1834

Joseph Price, found named in legal with the Guthrie family, wrote his will. He names his wife Nicey Price, and two sons Frederick and Russell. Witnesses are Epha W Guthrie, Joseph Guthrie, and Joshua Richards.

The 1810 Census lists Joseph’s wife as 26-44 years of age, born 1766-1784 so she is of the same generation as Frederick Guthrie. She might also be a Turner rather than a Guthrie.

1834: PROPERTY CONVEYANCE – GUTHRIE to WILLIS
Spartanburg County, South Carolina, USA on 22 August 1834

Joseph Guthrie sells to Hezakiah Willis for $100 land on Thickety Creek of Broad River, on a line between Joseph Guthrie and Frederick Guthrie, and a line between Joseph Guthrie and Joseph Guthrie Price.Witnesses were E. W. Guthrie and John Moore.

1836: MARRIAGE of SON – EPHRAIM W GUTHRIE
Spartanburg County, South Carolina, USA on 16 August 1836

Ephraim W Guthrie married Sinia Covey by whom he had 4 children:
– John Cisco Guthrie (1837-Unk)
– James Thomas Guthrie (1840-1914)
– Rachel Guthrie (1842-Unk)
– Samuel Harman Guthrie (1844-1925)

Abt. 1837: CHILDREN & FAMILIES MOVED to ARKANSAS

By 1837-1838 most of the siblings and their spouses moved from South Carolina to Arkansas including Rebecca & husband James Ferguson, Jonathan & wife Nancy (MNU), Samuel & wife Mariah (Jarrett), Polly & husband John Dunaway, Joseph & wife Susannah (Wood), Margaret & husband Joel Wood, Edmund & wife Nancy (MNU), Ephraim & wife Sinia (Covey).

1840: US CENSUS of SOUTH CAROLINA
Spartanburg County, South Carolina, USA

FREDK GUTHRIE HOUSEHOLD: 1M 80-89, 1F 70-79, 2Cannot Read/Write. Listed next to households of Jesse and Nicy Price. Other county entries for Wm Guthrie, John D Guthery, and Rebecca Guthery

1845: TESTIMONY GIVEN for REV. WAR PENSION APPLICATION
District 3, Spartanburg, South Carolina on 12 Dec 1845

Frederick Guthrie appeared in open court to provide testimony on his Revolutionary War Service to apply for a pension. [Fold3]

Question 1st: Where and what year was you born?
Answer: In Edgecombe County NC in the year 1763

Question 2nd: Hav you any record of your age?
Answer: I have the record in a Bible at home

Question 3rd: Where were you living when called in to the service? Where have you lived since the Revolution & where do you live now?
Answer: I was living in Rutherford County North Carolina and lived there until I moved to my present place of abode in Spartanburg, SC

Question 4th: How were called in to the service?
Answer: I was drafted

Question 5th: State the names of soldiers of the Regular Officers that were with the troops when you served.
Answer: Col. John Earle.

Question 6th: Had you any regular discharge from your officers?
Answer: I had no regular discharge from the service.

Question 7th: State the names of persons to whom you are known in your present neighborhood who can testify as to your character for veracity and their belief of your service as a soldier of the Revolution.
Answer: Rev. D Scruugg, Capt. John Martin, Jesse Scruggs.

One of Frederick Guthrie’s witnesses was a man named Solomon Abbott who testified that said Guthrie was a resident of Rutherford County, NC during the Revolutionary War while he, the said Abbott, was a resident of the neighboring county Spartanburg, SC. They met frequently despite the state/county lines.

See also: Frederick Guthrie R4396
Southern Campaigns American Revolution Pension Statements & Rosters

1848: DEATH of FREDERICK GUTHRIE
Spartanburg County, South Carolina, USA about 1848

Some sites list DOD of 12 Dec 1849, but this is after administrations and probate documents.

1848: PROPERTY SALE – GUTHRIE to PALMER
Spartanburg County, South Carolina, USA on 18 Nov 1848

p. 211-212. 18 Nov 1848. Deed of Conveyance. William Guthrie of Spartanburg Dist, to G.B. Palmer of Cleveland Co., N.C., for $60 sold 80 acres, on Rocky Fork of Thickety Creek,Signed, Wm Guthrie. Release of dower, 3 Apr 1849: Signed, Clementine (x) Guthrie

1848: ADMINISTRATION of ESTATE
William Guthrie is assigned as the Administrator of Frederick Guthrie’s Estate. Guthrie died intestate leaving no will. His relationship to William Guthrie is not stated.

1849: PETITION AGAINST ESTATE
Spartanburg County, South Carolina, USA on 6 April 1849

Lists real estate under the value of one thousand dollars situated & lying in the District of Spartanburg in the State aforesaid on the waters of Thickety Creek bounded by lands of Esaw Price John Thomas and others containing 130A

The petition re: the probate of Frederick Guthrie’s estate reads as follows’ “The petition of John Thomas & wife one of the heirs at law of the Estate of Frederick Guthrie – Decsd. Showeth that the said Decsd. died Intestate leaving at his death a small real estate under the value of one thousand dollars situated & lying in the District of Spartanburg in the State aforesaid on the waters of Thickety Creek bounded by lanmds of Esaw Price John Thomas and others containing one hundred and thirty acres more ore less subject to patition and division amongst the following distributees, to wit, Samuel Guthrie — the heirs of Joseph Guthrie, Decsd. Matthew Guthrie Ephriam Guthrie Alfid Dubery & Nancy his wife Josel Moor and Peggy his wife John Dunaway & Polly his wife the heirs of Johnathan Guthrie Decsd. James Furgason & Rebecca his wife that all the Distributies as aforesaid resides without the limits of this State Except a Duberry & his wife & your petitoners therefore pray that a citation do issue and (smeared) distributees as aforesaid cited before the Ordinary to show cause if any why the prayers of the petitioners should not be granted that such other proceedings be had in your Court as will cause said land sold and the proceeds of said legeky (?) disposed of according to Law and your petitioner will every pray, etc.
April 6, 1849
Teste: B.V. Trimmir
Signed John Thomas, his X mark for himself and wife

1861: DEATH of MARY ‘MOLLIE’ LOUALLEN
Spartanburg County, South Carolina, USA

Obituary:
Spartanburg Express, Spartanburg County, South Carolina
24 July 1861 (Page 2 CD 7)

“Died at the residence of Mr. John Thomas, near Allgood P.O., in this District, on the 1st inst., Mrs. Molly Guthrey, consort of Fred. Guthrey, deceased. Mrs. Guthrey died in her 90th year and is the last of our acquaintance, in these parts whose days were connected with the days of ’76. 

Mrs. Guthrey was the mother of six sons and five daughters, all of whom are dead, as far as we know, but, she has but one child, Mrs. Thomas, living in this country, and three grand children, one of whom is the wife of Rev. J. S. Ezell. One of her sons, Samuel Guthrey, was promoted to the seat of Judge of the Interior Court of Arkansas. Another – Edmond – has had both legs amputated; but when last heard from was a wealthy planter in Texas. Mrs. Guthrey, till within a few years, was a woman of a fine recollection; and we have listened with thrilling interest to many of her tales of the Revolution of ’76, and especially those of the battle at Cowpens. Of course, she was quite young at that time, but old enough to recollect something of a very painful character. As her father, Mr. Louallen, lived within three or four miles of the battle ground, and that, too, nearly in the enemy’s line of retreat, she saw and heard many things of importance. Some of which, by your permission, Mr. Editor, I will relate as her lips will reiterate them no more. She with her little brother was out early in the morning of the 17th January, 1781, gathering fuel, when they heard the drum beat; next came the firing , the first gun of which she heard distinctly. 

Soon after the engagement, a horse with saddle and bridle came up to the fence, which her father hitched. Next she saw the Red Coats (as she called them) coming through the woods. When they came up they called out Mr. Louallen and compelled him to mount the horse and protect them to the road. While they (the Red Coats) were engaged in a skirmish with their pursuers, Mr. Louallen made his escape and returned to his family, his wife being in no condition to be left. Very soon afterwards he looked out and saw more Red Coats coming. He determined not to be taken anymore; as such he shouldered his gun and started off. He was however, soon surrounded and shot dead in full view of his family. But one thing that made his death more deplorable; he was mistaken for a Tory, and killed by his friends, who, in order to protect their own persons from the cold, had stripped the coat s from the bodies of the British who had fallen in battle, and put them on. Soon after this Mrs. Louallen was stripped of nearly everything by the Tories, who rolled her little baby off of the last sheet, and left it lying on the floor. Thus it will appear that Mrs. Guthrey’s days were connected with those of the existence of the Government of the United States; alive when the Union was formed, and died after it was dissolved. Mrs. Guthrey made profession of religion and joined the Baptist Church a great many years since. She was the subject of great affliction and suffering for months before her death, but death now on her, and we trust she is freed from all pain and sorrow.

Allgood, July 3rd, 1861



The Guthrie DNA Project:

The project does not currently have a direct male descendant representing the family of Frederick Guthrie & Mollie Louallen in its Y-DNA project. This means the lineage has not been conclusively matched to any of the Guthrie Family Groups.

There are several participants in the Family Finder/Autosomal DNA project, which can potentially provide us with some genetic clues as to the origin of this Guthrie line.

Remember that a person with a single Guthrie lineage in their tree will be genetically related to only one Guthrie Family Group. Therefore, matches to people whose Guthrie lineages belong to other groups share DNA via some other non-Guthrie ancestor.

Since the Guthrie-Louallen line is currently an Ungrouped Guthrie Family, we are starting from the viewpoint that they could potentially belong to any of the established groups. We’re looking for patterns amongst the matches, and to see if the results skew toward any single group versus the others.

This family is known to have lived in the North Carolina and South Carolina region, so matches to people who have Guthrie ancestry could simply mean they also have other relatives in the same region.

YDNA Kits: None

Important Reminder  Matching Y-DNA results prove direct descent from a common paternal ancestor. A single Y-DNA test by a representative of your family line can conclusively identify your Guthrie Family Group.

Family Finder / Autosomal DNA Kits: 12

Kit 177620
Frederick Guthrie 1763NC-c1848SC > Lineage Not Listed

I do not have the full lineage for this project member. The closest matches for this kit are to Guthrie-Louallen descendants descending from their son Matthew. The results include matches to GFG1, GFG2, GFG3, GFG4, and GFG5 in addition to people from Ungrouped Guthrie Families and those without Family Trees connected to their profiles. 

The most intriguing new match is a Guthrie man descending from GFG5’s Shadrick Guthry & Malinda Badley who shares a common DNA segment with two of the other matches. One is a Guthrie-Louallen descendants, the other has No Tree and lists his ancestors as Texans. Two brothers from the White County, AR line are known to have gone to Texas.

Row 1 – Guthrie of Texas – No Tree
Row 2 – Guthrie Male – GFG5 Descendant – Shadrick Guthry & Malinda Badley
Row 3 – Descendant of Frederick & Mollie > son Samuel > daughter Frances

Chromosome 15
with Matching atDNA Segments

Impression: Inconclusive

Kit 177620

Kit 267257
Frederick Guthrie 1763NC-c1848SC > Matthew Guthrie 1794SC-1874GA > Frederick Lovic Guthrie > Marinda Ora Guthrie (2xGGM)

Kits 267257, 332527, and 332529 represent 3 generations of this Guthrie line. This is very helpful with Autosomal DNA tests because comparing results to an earlier generation lets you rule out some of the surname matches because they don’t share DNA with the individual who passed on that Guthrie DNA.

In this case there is shared atDNA between all three kits, with kit 177620 above, and with a descendant of an Arkansas Guthrie line who has No Tree on his profile page. White County, Arkansas is a known location for Guthrie-Louallen descendants.

This kit has no connections to GFG5 or the Carteret, NC line. There is 1 match to a person connected to GFG2A-Branch K, which is from SC-GA. 

Impression: Inconclusive

Kit 267257

Kit 332527
Frederick Guthrie 1763NC-c1848SC > Matthew Guthrie 1794SC-1874GA > Frederick Lovic Guthrie (2xGGF)

This kit is the middle generation of the 3 closely related project members. The results reflect a subset of her parent’s Guthrie results. Anyone on the match list who is not on the list of the parent with Guthrie ancestry is related by some other ancestor on the other parent’s side of the family.

There are no matches to people confirmed to belong to GFG5 or the Carteret, NC line. There are 3 matches to people connected to GFG2 (Branch A, Branch K, and subgroup GFG2C).

Impression: Inconclusive
Too many ungrouped or unknowns. Skews toward GFG2A amongst known groups.

Kit 332527

Kit 332529
Frederick Guthrie 1763NC-c1848SC > Matthew Guthrie 1794SC-1874GA (2xGGF)

This kit is the elder generation of 3 of Matthew’s descendants, so it is the most likely to capture autosomal DNA results common to the earlier generations of the Guthrie-Louallen line as well as any potential common atDNA segments with extended lines.

One match is to project member Kit 690456 (below), who is a male Guthrie descending from Frederick & Mollie’s son Matthew, with Matthew being their Most Recent Common Ancestor (MRCA). 

There are no known matches to GFG5 or the Carteret, NC line. Several matches to people who have not included a Family Tree in their profiles. Three matches to people from GFG2 (Branch G, Branch K, and subgroup GFG2C). Two others to groups GFG4 and GFG6.

Impression: Inconclusive
Too many ungrouped or unknowns.

Kit 332529

Kit 481884
Frederick Guthrie 1763NC-c1848SC > Matthew Guthrie 1794SC-1874GA > Edward / Edmund Guthrie 1848GA-1886AR (3xGGF)

This kit is another with multiple generations participating in atDNA testing including both of the subject’s parents. See kit 690460 below. This allows us to rule out any Guthrie matches who share DNA with the other side of the tree. Guthrie matches who share DNA with this kit’s Paternal Side (P) are not related to the Guthrie-Louallen family, which is part of the subject’s Maternal tree (M). Three of the matches to unknown Guthrie lines are on the Paternal side.

All of the matches to GFG2 ines are on the Maternal side. This does not automatically prove a Guthrie connection. However, it is proven to be a potential match.

Impression: Skews toward GFG2

Kit 481884

Kit 645605 
Frederick Guthrie 1763NC-c1848SC > Samuel Guthrie 1796SC-1857AR > Calvin Guthrie 1825-1862AR > Franklin W Guthrie 1853AR-1931 (2xGGF) +more

Sibling of B406179 and B406220. The only known Guthrie-Louallen matches for this kit are the participant’s siblings. Many ungrouped matches. Matches to known GFG are to GFG2 (Branch A), GFG4, GFG6, and GFG12. One match to Guthries of Carteret, NC.

Impression: Inconclusive

Kit 645605

Kit 690456 
Frederick Guthrie 1763NC-c1848SC > Matthew Guthrie 1794SC-1874GA _ Edward / Edmund Guthrie 1848GA-1886AR (2xGGF)

This project member is a male Guthrie currently without a Y-DNA test. He is a sibling of 690459, and close relation to other kits. Consequently, he has 6 matches to Guthrie-Louallen descendants. He has no matches to known members of GFG5 or to the Carteret, NC line. Matches to established groups include: GFG2 (Branch A, Branch D, Branch K), GFG3, GFG4. 

Impression: Inconclusive with a slight skew toward GFG2. Lots of ungrouped matches.

Kit 690456

Kit 690459 
Frederick Guthrie 1763NC-c1848SC > Matthew Guthrie 1794SC-1874GA _ Edward / Edmund Guthrie 1848GA-1886AR (2xGGF)

Sibling of 690456. 

Impression: Known groups skew toward GFG2, but lots of ungrouped matches

Kit 690459

Kit 690460
Frederick Guthrie 1763NC-c1848SC > Matthew Guthrie 1794SC-1874GA _ Edward / Edmund Guthrie 1848GA-1886AR (2xGGF)

This kit has several Guthrie-Louallen matches. Also a common match to the man whose family is from Arkansas, a likely descendant of the Guthrie-Louallen line. Six matches to GFG2 (Branches A, C, K, and subgroup GFG2C). There are no matches to known descendants of GFG5 or the Carteret, NC lines. Matches to other known groups include GFG3, GFG4, GFG7, GFG10, GFG11.

Impression: Skews toward GFG2

Kit 690460

Kit B88448
Frederick Guthrie 1763NC-c1848SC > Samuel Guthrie 1796SC-1857AR > Frances Guthrie 1827SC-p1910AR (3xGGM)

This kit has several matches to other Guthrie-Louallen descendants. Most of the remaining matches are ungrouped. Matches to known groups include GFG1A, GFG2 (Branches D and subgroup GFG2C), GFG3B, GFG9, and GFG13.

Impression: Inconclusive

Kit B88448

Kit B406179
Frederick Guthrie 1763NC-c1848SC > Samuel Guthrie 1796SC-1857AR > Calvin Guthrie 1825-1862AR > Franklin W Guthrie 1853AR-1931 (2xGGF) +more

Sibling to Kits 645605 and B406220

Impression: Inconclusive

Kit 406179

Kit B406220
Frederick Guthrie 1763NC-c1848SC > Samuel Guthrie 1796SC-1857AR > Calvin Guthrie 1825-1862AR > Franklin W Guthrie 1853AR-1931 (2xGGF) +more

Sibling to Kits 645605 and B406179.

Impression: Inconclusive

Kit B406220

Comments:

Those of you who have DNA tests should add a Family Tree to your profiles if you have not already done so. Recent generations can be privatized so that your genetic matches and project admins can assess your ancestral line. It’s all about comparing those apples and oranges. Knowing that a genetic match exists is only part of the equation. We need to know the origin of the DNA in order to complete the puzzle.

The family of Frederick Guthrie and Mollie Louallen would benefit greatly from a Y-DNA test. There is no clear-cut answer to be found within the Autosomal DNA tests above. More participation, especially from those of you with AncestryDNA tests (which will yield matches in greater volume), could tip the scales until a Y-DNA test can be obtained.

The charts below combine the individual kit result listing project kits for the Guthrie-Louallen family line and the individuals of Guthrie ancestry whom they match. These have been clustered by their GFG association, Ungrouped Guthrie Family or Unknown (No Tree / Not in Tree) status.

There are 150 individuals of the Guthrie surname and/or ancestry.

  • 15 are Guthrie-Louallen Descendants (12 Project Members)
    • 10% of the total number of matches.
  • 61 are from Established Guthrie Family Groups
    • 40.6% of the total number of matches.
      • GFG1: 9 matches – 14.7% of established GFG
      • GFG2: 24 matches – 39.3% of established GFG
      • GFG3: 7 matches – 11.4% of established GFG
      • GFG4: 8 matches – 13.1% of established GFG
      • GFG5: 3 matches – 4.9% of established GFG
      • GFG6: 3 matches – 4.9% of established GFG
      • GFG7: 1 match – 1.6% of established GFG
      • GFG8: 0 matches – 0% of established GFG
      • GFG9: 2 matches – 3.2% of established GFG
      • GFG10: 1 match – 1.6% of established GFG
      • GFG11: 1 match – 1.6% of established GFG
      • GFG12: 1 match – 1.6% of established GFG
      • GFG13: 1 match – 1.6% of established GFG
      • GFG14: 0 matches – 0% of established GFG
  • 27 are Unknown Guthrie Families – No Tree / Not in Tree
    • 18% of the total number of matches
  • 47 are Ungrouped Guthrie Families – No Proof of GFG origins
    • 31% of the total number of matches.

Based on results from the established Guthrie Family Groups, there appears to be a skew toward Guthrie Family Group 2A with 39.3% matching that group. However, between the Ungrouped Guthrie Families and those who remain Unidentified because they have no listed three, 49% of the Total number of matches are of unknown group origin.

Guthrie Family Group 2A is the largest of all of the genetic groups currently with 13 major branches (A thru M) residing in colonial America originating in either Scotland or Northern Ireland. It is easy to find genetic matches to people who happen to be related to GFG2A simply because they are found in so many places. They may be related to your relations without sharing direct Guthrie ancestry.

In this case, there are GFG2 matches amongst all of the kits. Some matches are to subgroups GFG2C and GFG2E. These are the results of mismatched YDNA, which could indicate the match is of non-Guthrie origin.

There are also several men and women of the Guthrie surname on these lists of matches. Hopefully, they will volunteer some details on their Guthrie ancestry, which could provide some crucial clues.

The matches to a key figure from Guthrie Family Group 5 for Kit 177620 do not appear to be duplicated in any of the other Guthrie-Louallen kits above. As the results stand now, there is no conclusive evidence that the Guthrie-Louallen line is genetically related to GFG5. This was considered because of the match to Kit 177620 and the common use of the name Shadrick. Autosomal DNA is fickle. There could potentially be GFG5 descendants amongst the still unknown or ungrouped Guthrie matches to swing these results in another direction. More genetic evidence would be helpful.


UPDATE: 4 Sep 2019

New project member Family Finder Kit 898982 descends from GFG5 – Branch C: Shadrick Guthrie and Malinda Badley. His autosomal DNA matches have a strong presence of cousins from his own line. There are also 3 matches to people who descend from Frederick Guthrie & Mollie Louallen and William Guthrie & Clementine Thomas, both couples being from Thickety Creek, SC. Shared autosomal DNA between individuals from these lines and Shadrick Guthrie’s descendants provides stronger evidence of a GFG5 connection for the Thickety Creek families.



This is your opportunity to add details to the collected documentation for the Frederick Guthrie & Mollie Louallen family, suggest corrections, discuss current theories, and develop new ones. If you’re one of those mysterious Guthries with no tree on your FTDNA profile, please share some details on the earliest generations of your tree. You’re also welcome to join the project.


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