Mistaken Identities: 2
Family Researchers Beware!
Your predecessors have been very creative with your ancestors.
These are common errors found in family trees and popular sites.
It’s a recipe for genealogical disaster! Two men named John born within a 2-year span. One in Halifax, VA and the other in Halifax, NC. One marries Anna and the other Betty Ann. All leading to a case of mixed up spouses on tangled family trees.
John Guthrey c1759 Cumberland, VA – 1833 Halifax, VA
(GFG4) – son of Thomas Guthrey/Sarah Oakes
This man married Elizabeth ‘Betty’ Ann Allen on 25 May 1785 in Cumberland County, VA. Marriage bond surety was provided by William Guthrie.
After their marriage, this couple moved to Halifax County, Virginia where they remained.
John Guthrie c1757 Hanover, VA – died 1821 Buncombe, NC
(GFG5) – son of William Guthrie/Eleanor Harris Abbott
This man lived in Halifax, NC, and it is most likely where he married his wife, Anna Smith. She was one of the daughters of Peter Smith. He died in Halifax, NC leaving a will naming his daughter as ‘Anna Guthrey’.
Numerous online trees currently list the spouse of John Guthrie of Family 2 as Betty Ann Allen rather than Anna Smith. That includes one site that many of you may consider a reliable resource: Find-a-Grave. Keep in mind that these memorials are sometimes simply user-submitted data. Even when you do find something literally written in stone, it’s still not always 100% accurate.
It’s easy to see how this might happen. Both men are named John. Both men lived in places called Halifax. Both women have a variation of the name Ann/Anna as part of their documented name. There are even 2 Williams involved. The William Guthrie listed in the marriage bond for John and Betty is actually John’s brother, not his father, who is a Thomas Guthrey. These are 2 genetically distinct unrelated families that have become unintentionally tangled.
Thanks to Beverly B. and her cousins for asking about NC Guthries and pointing out one example of this online mismatch at Find-a-Grave.
Below, are entries from the previous postings of Guthrie Genealogy’s Mistaken Identities.
Are you one of the guilty parties? No worries. You’re in good company.
If you’re scratching your head because you’ve seen the ‘wrong’ in a million places and it seems to be taken by everyone you know as the truth, let’s look at the evidence together.
After all, you don’t want someone else’s ancestors hanging out in your family tree.
Add other examples of repetitive errors that you have found in trees or online.
JOHN GUTHRIE is not CAPT. JOHN MONTROSE GUTHRIE
When 300+ people copy someone’s error again and again it starts to look legit…even if it’s not.
John Guthrie (variants: Gutteridge, Guttrey, Guthrey, & others) who married Elizabeth Baskett, lived in Christ Church Parish, Middlesex County, Virginia, and died there in 1706, has no documented middle name or title. The identities of his parents and location of his birth in Scotland are not found in the CCP Register or Vestry Books. In other words, “Captain John Montrose Guthrie” is a made up name, or at the least an incorrectly assigned one.
Online trees frequently attach John Guthrie of Middlesex, VA to parents James Guthrie & Elizabeth Auchterlonie or Auchtersorny. James is also frequently listed as James Montrose Guthrie. There is a birth/baptismal record in the OPR for ‘Jhon Guthrie‘, son of James Guthrie and Elizabeth Ouchterlony on 9 Aug 1661 in Arbroath. However, there are a number of infants named John Guthrie born in Scotland within a reasonable estimated birthdate range who could be John Guthrie of Middlesex. Neither his DOB nor age is found in the Christ Church Parish records in Middlesex County, Virginia. There are about 10 infants named John born in Angus and quite a few more elsewhere in Scotland within a 20-year span. Too many to narrow it down to one couple without other evidence. There are no clues within the CCP Register or Vestry Books to suggest the identity of his parents.
What is the source of the middle name ‘Montrose’? It is not in any original documentation associated with John Guthrie of Middlesex, VA. There were Guthrie families living in Montrose, Angus, Scotland, but none known to be associated with this man. It is not even the location of the marriage of James Guthrie & Bessie Ochterlony, nor the location of the birth of their son, John, both of which occurred in Arbroath. The baptismal record does not list a middle name.
There is also no known evidence supporting a title of captain. John Guthrie’s documented occupation per the CCP records is a planter. He is not the Captain Guthrie/Guttrey found in multiple colonial Virginia entries, who was the master of the Ewe and Lamb, a merchant vessel that also transported convicts to the colonies. See Blog entries on Tidewater Virginia Families and Colonial Prisoners and Convicts.
JOHN GUTHRIE is also not JOHN HOWARD PAUL GUTHRIE
Unless we’re dealing with reincarnation…this guy born 200 years later is a different man.
This name keeps popping up as an alternate to John Guthrie of Middlesex, VA (1689VA-1733VA) son of John Guthrie and Elizabeth Baskett, including on a Wikitree site. There is indeed a John Howard Paul Guthrie who was born to a John Guthrie and his wife Elizabeth…. The baptismal record transcription pops up in Ancestry as a hint and people have attached it to John Guthrie of Middlesex, VA without actually looking at the record itself. If you actually open up the record, you’ll see that the baptism occurs in 1881 England. Clearly, the record for John Howard Paul Guthrie has nothing to do with John Guthrie of Middlesex, who was born about 200 years earlier. There is no original document in current circulation that identifies a middle name or initial for John Guthrie.
ELIZABETH (MAIDEN NAME UNKNOWN) vs. ELIZABETH DUNLAP
Oh, my Elizabeth, must thou forever be falsely named Dunlap?
Elizabeth Dunlap died at sea on the way to Virginia in 1774 along with her husband, James Guthrie. She was not the same woman as Elizabeth (MNU) who was married to the James Guthrie living in Orange County, North Carolina. These are two separate couples.
James Guthrie (bef.1715-1774) was born in Scotland. His father was also a James Guthrie, who sent him to Ireland to live with his uncle, John Guthrie, a lawyer living in County Cork. There he married Elizabeth Dunlap, and they had several daughters, Margaret (FNU Walker), Betsey (never married), Jennie (FNU Jennings), Mary (Jacob Bilderback), and 1 unidentified (FNU Walker), and only one son, Adam Guthrie (Hannah Polke). James, Elizabeth, and their daughters set sail for Virginia in 1774. Both parents died on the journey, and daughter Betsey’s leg was injured. Adam had remained in Ireland with his great-uncle to become his heir, but was soon sent to Virginia join his sisters. He eventually settled in Kentucky.
James Guthrie (abt.1720-1801) was born in Ireland, probably to John Guthrie and Jane Stuart who reportedly lived in or near Londonderry. His wife was also named Elizabeth, but her maiden name has never been discovered in family documentation. They came from Ireland in the 1760s first settling in Baltimore, Maryland and later in Orange County, North Carolina. This couple’s children were: James (Jane Smith), Mary (Alexander McMenamy), Ann (John Shannon), Robert (Mary Smith), Margaret (John Forrest), Martha (FNU Barnett), Jean (John Madden), and Elizabeth (Robert Patton). James’ widow Elizabeth died sometime after 1810.
Note that trees also edit in other incorrect surnames for our dear Elizabeth (MNU) associated with other men named James Guthrie. Please select the correct ancestor for your tree.
LUCILE ‘LUCY’ (GUTHRIE) VINSON is not ELIZABETH, ELIZABETH LUCILE or ELIZABETH BETSY
Wrong Name. Wrong Parents. Wrong Locations.
Lucy Guthrie, born in North Carolina about 1765, has been popping up in various trees as part of my GFG2A Guthrie family, when in fact there is no evidence of James & Elizabeth (MNU) Guthrie having a daughter by that name. Trees bypass this well-documented fact by merging Lucy with their daughter Elizabeth and conveniently identifying their ancestor as Elizabeth Lucile Guthrie. This is an obvious error easily proven by multiple records identifying the siblings.
Elizabeth Guthrie, daughter of James & Elizabeth (MNU) Guthrie of Orange County, North Carolina married Robert Patton on 28 July 1803 in that location. They initially moved to Robertson County, Tennessee where her two brothers had settled on the Robertson-Sumner border, and between 1814-1818 moved to Gallatin County, Illinois where they remained. Elizabeth was the mother of ten children with her husband Robert Patton. She died between 1830-1840 and is buried in the Patton Cemetery in Illinois.
Lucy (Guthrie) Vinson is also not the same woman as Elizabeth ‘Betsy’ Guthrie, the daughter of James Guthrie and Elizabeth Dunlap, whose parents died at sea on the way to America in 1774. Betsy severely injured her leg during the voyage. She is documented by other family members as remaining a spinster having never married. “I well remember Aunt Betsey, a very small feeble old lady, who was very lame and spent much of her time in studying the Holy Scriptures.” (American Guthrie & Allied Families, Appendix, p.721) Also note that the children of James Guthrie and Elizabeth Dunlap settled in Virginia, not North Carolina.
Lucy Guthrie is shown to have married William Vinson on 22 Jan 1787 in Wake County, North Carolina. (Not even the same county where my Guthrie family lived.) The 1790 census of North Carolina shows the household of a Lewry Guthrie listed on the same page as households of Reuben Vinson, Saml Vinson, and Wm Vinson. It seems to make far more sense that Lucy Guthrie is a daughter or relative of Lewry Guthrie from the same area as the Vinson family she married into.
William & Lucy (Guthrie) Vinson and family lived in North Carolina, Kentucky, and Illinois. William is documented as a pioneer settler of DeWitt County, Illinois in 1829. The wife of William Vinson, presumably Lucy, was enumerated with him as a 60-69 year old during the 1830 census of Mackinaw, Tazewell, Illinois.
DO YOU COUNT ONE or TWO GUTHRIE-NORWOOD MARRIAGES in ABBEVILLE, SC?
No…I’m really asking. Is the Norwood marriage for GFG9 a real thing?
Thomas Guthrie 1732SCT-1797SC & Jean Duncan’s family came from Orkney, Scotland in Sep 1774 to Savannah, Georgia as indentured servants. They eventually settled in South Carolina. Their 8 children include 3 sons: Adam (1761-bef. 1797), Thomas (1762- bef. 1797), and John (c1764-aft.1830). The latter is believed to have married a Jean Norwood. Was she actually a Norwood? They had a large family many of which remain unidentified.
Robert Guthrie 1773NC-1856TN married Jane Norwood (Just “Jane”, not “Martha Jane”. Please note that she had erroneously been identified by a family researcher as Martha Jane Norwood, who has since identified and corrected the mistake.) Robert is frequently added as a son of Thomas Guthrie & Jean Duncan, above, but Robert’s family line belongs to a genetically unrelated Guthrie Family Group.
Are there really two Norwoods named Jean & Jane? Census and court records name Robert’s wife as Jane. The Norwood father’s will names his Guthrie daughter as Jean. The Norwood Bible Record lists an “X”.
Many of you have from GFG9 have incorrectly listed Robert Guthrie as a son of Thomas Guthrie, which has led to Ancestry’s ThruLines falsely creating “potentially” related reports to this GFG13 line. The genetic relationship to the person is accurate, but it comes via a non-Guthrie ancestor, possibly even a Norwood one depending on your take on the one vs two Jane Norwoods situation.
ADAM GUTHRIE is not ADAM GUTHRIE nor ADAM GUTHRIE
Please select the appropriate ancestor for your tree.
Adam Guthrie b1740-45 in IRE – died 1827 in KY was married to Mary Anderson. This couple had 5 children: James (1777), George W (1780), Elizabeth Mary (1784), Nancy (1786), and Thomas (1789). This family belongs to GFG7.
This Adam Guthrie is frequently mistaken for:
Adam Guthrie c1761SCT-bef.1797, son of Thomas Guthrie & Jean Duncan of GFG9. He is not mentioned in Thomas’ 1797 will and is believed to have died prior to that date. No known descendants.
Adam Guthrie 1762IRE-1826KY & Hannah Polke, son of James Guthrie & Elizabeth Dunlap. Adam was their only son. His children include James Guthrie (1792-1868), US Secretary of the Treasury / Kentucky State Senator. Others were: Elizabeth (1789), Edmund (1791), John Berry (1794), Mary (1796), Sarah (1798), Nancy (1800), Hannah (1801).
GEORGE GUTHRIE is not GEORGE NELSON GUTHRIE
Two different genetically unrelated men.
George Guthrie (1750PA-1813PA) was the son of Robert Guthrie & Bridget Dougherty. He grew up in Cumberland County, Pennsylvania and married Margaret Campbell. After his marriage he moved to Huntingdon, Pennsylvania. Known Children: Sarah (1775), William Campbell (1780), Jane (c1790), (FNU Daughter), James (d.1803). George died in Hollidaysburg, Blair, Pennsylvania between October and November of 1813. Descendants include Rev. Laurence R. Guthrie, author of ‘American Guthrie and Allied Families’. This line is part of GFG2A-Branch E.
George Nelson Guthrie is estimated to have been born between 1830-1850 in Ireland. According to the ‘Guthrie Family History’ written by Henry Guthrie, George was one of 4 brothers. They lived in the NJ/NY area. His wife remains unidentified. George left with his family about the time of the Revolutionary War, but the remaining brothers stayed behind to fight and two of them became ‘high ranking’. The brothers’ identities are also unknown. George’s children settled in the Columbiana/Richland County areas of Ohio: William (1771), John Earnesst (1774), Richard (1777), Samuel (1792), Hannah (1794). It is unknown whether George made it to Ohio. Participants in the Guthrie DNA Project representing this line are designated as GFG14. The Y-DNA (direct paternal line) profile matches men of the Joyce/Joice surname.
ROBERT GUTHRIE is not ROBERT WAYNE GUTHRIE
No Middle Name Found in Documentation.
GFG2A-Branch E: Robert Guthrie (c1700IRE-1782PA) of Carlisle, Cumberland, Pennsylvania who was married to Bridget Dougherty was a carpenter and cabinet maker. He can be found in various online trees with the middle name of ‘Wayne’, yet there has been no original documentation found listing him with a middle initial or middle name of any kind. Ditto goes for his son Robert Guthrie (1737-1808) who can be found in the same trees with the same use of the middle name ‘Wayne’ despite the lack of documentation. The name Wayne has not been found in general within GFG2A during the colonial period.
MARY (GUTTERY) HAGGARD is not MARY GUTTERY
There are a few trees out there that don’t bother to list an identity for Granville Grey Haggard’s wife. If there is any original documentation out there to suggest her name please share it. In the meantime, there are hundreds of trees listing his wife as the daughter of William Guthrie / Guttery & Frances Wilbourn of Christ Church Parish, who was born there in 1730. Just one problem. . . their daughter Mary died at a little over one month of age.
According to the Christ Church Parish Register…
Mary daughter of William & Frances Guttery born March ye 26. baptized April ye 3 1730.
Mary daughter of William Guthrie dyed May ye 5. 1730.
William Guthrie / Guttery was twice married. First to Lettice Burk, in 1716 Christ Church Parish, Middlesex, Virginia, with whom he had 3 daughters. Lettice died in 1727, and William remarried to Frances Wilbourn in 1728, again in Christ Church Parish. They lived in the same location and their children are documented in the Christ Church Parish Register. Only one indication of a child named Mary for this couple, and her birth and death in 1730 are documented.
The wife of Granville Gray Haggard is usually listed in trees as ‘Mary Guttery’ and with the 1730 DOB of the Mary Guttery above from Christ Church Parish. An alternate birth location for Granville’s wife is listed as Stafford County, Virginia, which is the location he was born in 1728. The couple reportedly married in 1742 in Albemarle County, Virginia. Note this would indicate that Mary was only 12 at the time of the marriage, which is very young even by colonial standards. Mary is also referred to as his ‘Lady Wife’, which may be sourced from a record or family history that I have not seen yet. They had a large family and the wife died about 1762 in Albemarle, Virginia.
REV. ROBERT GUTHRIE is not ROBERT HODGE GUTHRIE
Seems Like More of a Hodge-Podge.
GFG2A-Branch A’s Robert Guthrie was born 12 Nov 1770 near Baltimore, Maryland and died in September of 1843 in Keytesville, Chariton, Missouri. He was a Cumberland Presbyterian. There is no known record that lists a middle name for this man. There is also no use of the name Hodge in this family line.
There is a collaterally related Guthrie branch within GFG2A that has a Guthrie-Hodge marriage, however that line is a distant one. GFG2A-Branch B’s William Forguison Guthrie married Mary Hodge Slaughter in 1811. Mary’s mother’s maiden name was Sarah Hodge.
EDWIN GUTHRIE is not EDWIN B GUTHRIE nor THOMAS EDWIN GUTHRIE
A Case of Mixed Up and Merged Edwins
There are definitely two legitimate individuals here, and a third whose identity is a conglomeration of multiple people.
Edwin Guthrie was born on 27 June 1808 in Buncombe County, NC per his Alabama Voter’s registration card. The Alabama census records contrarily list his birthplace as SC. This man married Mary Elizabeth Cagle, probably in Hall County, Georgia about 1834. Children: Robert Lepezant Guthrie, E Milly Guthrie, Sarah J Guthrie, William Edmond Guthrie, Charles B Guthrie, Idella Elizabeth Guthrie, John D C Guthrie. Edwin’s exact DOD is unknown. He was alive during the 1870 census of Winston, AL, but his wife Elizabeth is listed as a widow by 1880. Edwin and Elizabeth’s descendants belong to Guthrie Family Group 13.
Edwin Guthrie is sometimes mistaken for Edwin B Guthrie who was born on 11 Dec 1806 in New York to parents Samuel Guthrie, the physician and inventor, and his wife Sybil Sexton. This man married Adeline Jewett in 1827. They had 2 sons: Southwick Guthrie and John W Guthrie. According to an entry in American Guthrie and Allied Families, he was commissioned Captain of Company K, Fifteenth US Infantry, and went to the front during the Mexican-American War. He was wounded in the knee by a guerrilla on 20 June 1847 and suffered two amputations that were unsuccessful in saving his life. He died that day after dictating a couple of letters. Signing them was the last act of his life. Some trees are confusing his death date with that of the Edwin Guthrie of Winston, Alabama, above. This family belongs to the Guthrie Family Group 2A-Branch F family descending from John Guthrie and Abigail Coe.
Then we have Thomas Edwin Guthrie and/or Thomas Edwin Edward Guthrie who is listed in various trees as the son of William Palmore Guthrie (GFG4) and Elizabeth Turner Coleman (not even his wife) or as the son of John Barnett Guthrie and Mary ‘Polly’ Rylee (GFG2E). They all list 27 June 1808 South Carolina as his birthplace and about 1900 as his date of death. William Palmore Guthrie (1800VA-1861VA) was married to Sarah Ann Coleman on 24 Nov 1819. They did not have a son named Thomas or Edwin. Elizabeth Turner Coleman was married to William ‘Buck’ Guthrie (1781VA-1848VA). They had a son Edward Travis, but no Thomas Edwin. Both William ‘Buck’ Guthrie and William Palmore Guthrie are descendants of William Guthrey and Rebecca Noel of Guthrie Family Group 4 from Virginia. As for the couple John Guthrie and Mary ‘Polly’ Rylee of GFG2E, they did have a son named Thomas Guthrie born 1800-1810 in Georgia. He married Elizabeth Cape in Hall County, Georgia on 19 Aug 1827. Note this is the same location that the first Edwin Guthrie married Mary Elizabeth Cagle in 1834, so this may be part of the confusion. They are 2 separate couples. Thomas and Elizabeth (Cape) Guthrie lived in Walker & Hancock Counties, Alabama. There is no known association of the name Edwin with this family.
JAMES ‘JIM’ GUTHRIE b.1827 TN is not JAMES IRVIN GUTHRIE b.1827 TN
Two Separate Men. Please Choose the Correct Ancestor & Spouse. Do Not Mix & Match.
James Guthrie aka Jim was born about 1827 in Tennessee, most likely in Warren County as that is where his parents were living during the 1830 census. Those parents were Carter Guthrie and Barbara Beal. Jim was their youngest son. His marriage to Elvira Randolph (or Arbuckle) occurred about 1845-1848, probably in TN or AR. The family had moved to Madison County, Arkansas before 1850. Jim and Elvira were parents to Cherry Matilda ‘Tilda’ Guthrie, John Alexander Guthrie, Emley Tennessee Guthrie, Louisa Jane Guthrie, Nancy Guthrie, and James Guthrie. The wife, Elvira, died about 1858 in Madison County, AR. Jim presumably remarried prior to 1860 to a young woman named Nancy who appears on the 1860 census. According to family lore, Jim was killed by bushwhackers sometime between 1864-1865 in Madison County, AR.
My direct ancestor, James Irvin Guthrie, was born on 26 Nov 1827 in Sumner County, TN, the son of Robert Guthrie, a farmer, and his wife Aseneth C Motheral. He lived and died in Sumner, TN. He volunteered for the Mexican War at age 19. He married his cousin, Nancy Elizabeth Guthrie, the daughter of Robert Wesley Guthrie, a farmer, and his wife Nancy Foster, on 11 Nov 1852. James and Nancy were the great-grandchildren of Scot-Irish immigrants James Guthrie 1720IRE-1801NC & wife Elizabeth (MNU). They were parents to Zerelda Caledonia ‘Callie’ Guthrie, William H Guthrie, Louanna Jane Guthrie, Edward Motheral Guthrie, Mary Ella Guthrie, Robert Wesley Guthrie, and Nancy Acenith ‘Nannie’ Guthrie.
I have come across several trees listing my ancestors James and Nancy as the parents of one or all of the children belonging to Jim and Elvira, especially as Jim’s second wife is also a Nancy.
TWO WIVES of GULIELMUS COLEMAN JR: NANCY and NANCY, but not NANCY.
New evidence is shaking up the Coleman-Guthrey/Guthrie Family Tree.
All parties agree that Gulielmus Coleman Jr was married twice. The first occurred 1 July 1812. The wife is recorded as ‘Sarah White’, which is believed to be a transcription error. The ‘Widow White’ was Nancy Ann (Guthrie) White the widow of James White whom she had married 8 Dec 1803. James and Nancy were parents to a daughter named Sarah, which could be the point of confusion. Gulielmus and Nancy were parents to several children born between 1813-1822. Nancy died sometime between 1822-1826.
American Guthrie and Allied Families, in his section on The Colemans, pp.524-526, reveals “Gulielmus Coleman Jr married (2) May 20, 1826, Nancy Guthrie, who was born about 1800 and was a sister of Henry Guthrie. She was a second or third cousin of the first wife.”
Currently, online family trees list the second wife as Nancy Turner Guthrey, daughter of William ‘Buck’ Guthrie and Elizabeth Turner Coleman. This would make her Gulielmus Coleman Jr’s niece by blood and by marriage. That should have raised a few red flags. She also does not have a brother named Henry as was the clue found in AGAF. The correct marriage for Nancy Turner Guthrie may be to John Wiley Coleman. She died 6 Feb 1878 in Petersburg City, Virginia.
The second wife of Gulielmus Coleman Jr was actually the first cousin of the first. Nancy Guthrey, daughter of Henry Guthrey and his wife Patience ‘Patsy’ (MNU). Henry is one of the sons of Thomas Guthrey and Sarah Oakes. His family has largely been ignored online for some reason until Patrick Hoggard’s research shed some light on this family. This Nancy Guthrey does indeed have a brother named Henry. Probate and chancery court documents naming Gulielmus Coleman Jr identify him as the spouse of Henry’s daughter Nancy by way of the relationships defined in those documents.
JOHN GUTHRIE & JANE SIXSMITH versus JOHN GUTHRIE & JANE (JEAN) LAIDLAW
Records for “John Guthrie and wife Jane” are frequently Assigned to Wrong Couple
People with the same given names frequently end up with the wrong children assigned to their family. These two couples were born about the same time, and resided in England, but their records place them within two distinct locations.
John Guthrie, a police constable, was born in Liverpool, Lancashire, England according to the census records. This suggests that he may be the John Guthrie born 13 Jan 1794 to James Guttery (Carpenter) and Ellen Eccleston. He married Jane Sixsmith on 24 June 1822 in Saint Anne Parish, Soho, London, England, and afterward is found living n New Windsor / Windsor, Berkshire, England. Children born to this couple are documented with birth records and census records in Berkshire. James (1824), John (1826), Anna (1828), Alfred (1831), Joseph William (1833), Thomas (1826), Henry (1836), and Jane (1839). John Guthrie died bet. 1852 and 1859 in Windsor, Berkshire, England. His widow Jane (Sixsmith) Guthrie is believed to have died bet. 1861-1871.
The second couple tends to get overlooked and their children erroneously assigned to the above couple. John Guthrie, a tailor, was born in Scotland about 1790. There are 11 births in Scotland between 1789-1791 for infants named John Guthrie, so without further evidence there is no way to narrow that number down. He married in St Cuthbert’s Parish, Edinburgh, Midlothian, Scotland. “John Guthrie taylor No. 13 South Saint David’s Street, and Jean Liddle, daughter of the late David Liddle residing in Dumiehouse.” Note that Jane is the Anglicized version of Jean, which was used once this family moved to England. The wife’s surname Liddle is also a phonetic match for Laidlaw, and the latter is documented in the OPR birth records for the two eldest daughters born in Scotland. “John Guthrie merchant taylor St Andrew’s Street and Jean Laidlaw his spouse had a daughter born 7th March last Jane.” and “John Guthrie merchant tailor & Jean Laidlaw HS St Andrew’s Parish A D B 17 May last Nd Catherine.” This couple moved to London, England before their son John was born in 1824. Subsequent records for this family are documented in Shorditch, London, Middlesex, England. Children: Jane (1821), Catherine (1822), John (1824), Harriett (1830), George (1833), James (1835), and Emma (1837).
JOHN GUTHRIE (mason) & RACHEL LAW versus JOHN GUTHRIE (carter) & RACHEL WICK
Trees and Find-a-Grave Identify the Wrong Couple
John Guthrie, a mason, was born somewhere in Scotland about 1829. He married Rachel Law at St Cuthbert’s parish on 3 June 1850. (OPR Marriage Record: JOHN GUTHRIE, mason, No.5 Castle Barns, & RACHEL LAW, also residing same place, both in this parish, 4th daughter of late WILLIAM LAW, farmer at Bellfield in Parish of Lanark, married at St Cuthberts.) This couple immigrated to the USA within 3 years of their marriage. They arrived on a British ship, the ‘Ann Harley’ on 17 Aug 1853 from Glasgow. (Manifest: John Guthrie, 24, male, mason, born Scotland, destination New York; Rachael Guthrie 22, female, born Scotland, destination New York, Eliza Guthrie, 10 months, female, born Scotland, destination New York). Other children born in America were Rachel (1855-1859), Anna (1857-1861), William James (1859-1938), and Rachel L (1862-1942). The family moved from New York to Michigan where John enlisted in Company E of the Michigan Infantry during the Civil War. He died on 3 Oct 1864. Rachel (Law) Guthrie survived him. She moved to Santa Barbara, California with family members. She died 23 Jan 1901 and is buried at Santa Barbara Cemetery.
The above couple is misidentified in family trees as John Guthrie, a carter, and Rachel Wick from Kirkwall, Orkney, Scotland. This couple lived and died in Kirkwall. They married on 28 Dec 1848 in Kirkwall. The family are consistently listed in the Scotland Census for 1851, 1861, 1871, 1881. John died in 1881. Rachel and unmarried family and some grandchildren are listed together in 1891. John Guthrie’s death record lists his death in Kirkwall on 17 April 1881. (OPR: JOHN GUTHRIE, carter, married to RACHEL WICK, died 630AM at Strynd, Kirkwall, 53, Parents: THOMAS GUTHRIE, sexton, ELIZABETH SWANEY, both decd, COD: Oedema Glottidis, Info: JOHN GUTHRIE, son.) His wife, Rachel (Wick) Guthrie, died on 22 Jan 1892. (OPR: Rachel Guthrie, widower of John Guthrie, carter, died 22 Jan 1892 9pm, The Strand, Kirkwall, F, 72 years, Parents: Peter Wick, flesher, deceased, Margaret Wick, m.s. Harsue, deceased, COD: apoplexy. Info: John Guthrie, son.) The couple were parents to Peter Wick (1849-1935), Margaret (1851), Jemima Wick (1853-1907), Jamima (1856-????), Elizabeth Jean (1858-????), and John (1861-1936).