C: Edwin Guthrie & Mary Elizabeth Cagle

ORIGIN THEORIES for GFG13 – BRANCH C

Edwin Guthrie 1808SC-c1875AL & Mary Elizabeth Cagle
of South Carolina, Georgia & Alabama, USA

Edwin Guthrie’s South Carolina origins are revealed by the Census Records for 1850, 1860, and 1870, which all list his birthplace as SC. This location is also a key residence for GFG13 – Branch B, which made its home in the Abbeville District before moving to Tennessee. For that reason, Branch C may descend from Branch B: Descendants of Robert Guthrie and Jean Norwood.

One descendant mentions an alternate location for Edwin Guthrie’s birth is Buncombe County, NC, which is reportedly listed on a Winston County, AL Voter and Oath of Allegiance list in 1867. (The image of the original Voter List found for 1867 does not list birthplace, but this data might be on the Loyalty Oath document. No original image found online so far.) The Cagle family also has a connection to Buncombe, NC. However, neither the Francis Guttery nor John Guttery households in 1810 Buncombe list any children under 10 years of age.

There also seems to be some misidentification regarding Edwin Guthrie and his wife Mary Elizabeth Cagle. Some trees have merged both names and data with Thomas Guthrie & Elizabeth Cape, who belong to GFG2A-Branch K’s subgroup GFG2E. Their descendants are not genetically related to GFG13. I also find no evidence that Edwin’s first name was Thomas.

The overall group origins point toward County Antrim, Northern Ireland, but there is no known direct connection between this branch and ancestors tracing beyond Edwin’s generation.

THE GUTHRIE DNA PROJECT

Guthrie Family Group: GFG13
Group Designation: Branch C – (The Guthries of Winston County, Alabama)

Haplogroup: I-M223
Confirmed Haplogroup: I-M223

YDNA Matches: 1
Kit 515716
Edwin Guthrie/Mary Elizabeth Cagle > Robert Lepezant Guthrie/Laura L Waynick (GGP) +more


Family Finder / Autosomal DNA Kits: 2
Kit 128913
Edwin Guthrie/Mary Elisabeth Cagle > Robert Lepezant Guthrie/Lydia Dodd > Theoffles Franklin Guthrie/Sarah Halifield (GGP) +more

Kit 211352
Edwin Guthrie/Mary Elisabeth Cagle > Robert Lepezant Guthrie/Lydia Dodd (GGP) +more


Findings:

Kit 515716 is currently a Y37 marker test matching Group Mode DNA (the most common value at any given genetic marker) 36/37.

DYS458 = 16 vs 17.

This one genetic variance is shared by Kit 128463 of GFG13-Branch B, which suggests that Branches B and C could share more recent common ancestry than they do with Branch A. However, due to the limited size of the group, that specific marker has not yet been proven to be a shared pattern marker inherited down a specific line within the group.

An examination of the Autosomal DNA matches for Kits 211352 and 128913, who are closely related, also have numerous matches to people of Norwood ancestry. This also strengthens the case that Edwin Guthrie is a descendant of Branch B.

THE FAMILY of EDWIN GUTHRIE & MARY ELIZABETH CAGLE

EDWIN GUTHRIE
Born: 27 June 1808
Location: South Carolina, USA
Married: Mary Elizabeth Cagle about 1834, probably in Georgia, USA
Occupation: Farmer
Died: About 1875
Location: Winston County, Alabama, USA
Buried: Winston County, Alabama, USA, presumably


MARY ELIZABETH CAGLE
Born: April 1815
Location: Georgia, USA
Sons: Robert Lepezant Guthrie (1835), William E Guthrie (1844), Charles B Guthrie (1850), John D C Guthrie (1857)
Daughters: E Milla Guthrie (1836), Sarah J Guthrie (1841), Idella Elizabeth Guthrie (1855)
Died: After 1900
Location: Winston County, Alabama, USA
Buried: Winston County, Alabama, USA, presumably


CHILDREN:

ROBERT LEPEZANT GUTHRIE
1835GA-1904AR

Robert Lepezant Guthrie was born in December of 1835 reportedly in Hall County, Georgia. He was listed with his parents in the 1850 census of Hall, GA and the 1860 census of Winston, AL with his parents. He married his first wife, Lydia Dodd in Winston on 18 August 1865. They were parents to 1 daughter and 5 sons. I am going to assume that their marriage ended in divorce sometime after the birth of son Silas in 1881. Lydia was still alive through the 1910 census of Marion, AL, and listed as a widow since 1900 even though Robert was also still living. He married again on 13 February 1895 in Kennett, Dunklin, Missouri to Laura Waynick. They settled in Arkansas and it appears that the younger children from his marriage to Lydia remained with Robert and his new wife. Laura also gave Robert a son and three daughters. He died in Greenway, Clay, AR on 12 March 1904. Laura died in 1906. Lydia died sometime after the 1910 census.

Children: 10
Sons: McDaniel Guthrie (1870), Andrew Jacob Guthrie (1872), William Edward Guthrie (1874), Theoffles Franklin Guthrie (1876), Silas Royal Guthrie (1881), Robert Paul Guthrie (1896)
Daughters: Thana Ann Guthrie (1868), Maude L Guthrie (1897), Pearl Guthrie (1900), Grace Darling Guthrie (1903)

Y-DNA Project Participants: Yes
Family Finder Participants: Yes


E MILLA GUTHRIE
1836GA – After 1860AL

This daughter was born about 1836 in Georgia. She is listed in census records as E. Guthrie or Milla Guthrie. Possibly variations on Emily or Emilia. Not listed with the family in 1870 suggesting that she married or died prior to that date. No further data.


SARAH J GUTHRIE
1841GA – 1910AL

Sarah Guthrie was born about May of 1841 in Georgia, presumably Hall County. She remained single through the 1870 census of Winston, AL where she was living with her parents. In 1878, she had a son, presumably out of wedlock, named Seburn Monroe Guthrie. During the 1880 census, she is head of her own household, listed as widowed, but still under the name Sarah J Guthrie. Her son Monroe Guthrie, age 2, is listed with her.

Children: 1
Sons: Seburn Monroe Guthrie (1878)
Daughters: None

Family Finder Participants: No


WILLIAM EDMOND GUTHRIE
1844GA – 1910AL

William was born on 7 June 1844 in Hall County, Georgia. He married Nancy Wilson about 1864 in Alabama, presumably Winston County. They were farmers raising 4 sons and 3 daughters in Winston. By 1910 they moved to Marion County, AL. William died in Kimbrough, Marion, AL in 1910. His widow Nancy lived with their daughter Dollie and family in her declining years. She died on 1 July 1937 in Loretto, Lawrence County, TN.

Children: 7
Sons: John Paul Guthrie (1865), George Daniel Guthrie (1871), James W Guthrie (1873), Thomas L Guthrie (1875)
Daughters: Idella ‘Della’ Frances Guthrie (1883), Dollie Pink Guthrie (1889)

Y-DNA Project Participants: No
Family Finder Participants: No


CHARLES B GUTHRIE
1850GA – Bet.1880-87AR

Charles was born about 1850 in Georgia or Alabama, He married Martha Ann Berry, presumably in Alabama. They had 2 sons and 2 daughters. This family resided in Smith, Cross County, Arkansas in 1880. Charles died between 1880-1887. His widow Martha remarried to James Lee Frizzell on 7 August 1887. She died in 1924.

Children: 4
Sons: James M Guthrie (1875), Ben Harvey Guthrie (1879)
Daughters: Alice Florinda Guthrie (1867), Callie Guthrie (1885)

Y-DNA Project Participants: No
Family Finder Participants: No


IDELLA ELIZABETH GUTHRIE
1855AL-1919AL

Idella Elizabeth Guthrie was born on 5 September 1855 in Winston County, AL. She married Jerry M Martin about 1878 and they continued to live in Winston County. They had 3 sons and 5 daughters. Jerry was a farmer. Idella died on 12 March 1919.

Children: 8
Sons: Charles Francis Martin (1881), William Thomas Martin (1883), Joseph E Martin (1891)
Daughters: Leona E Martin (1885), Emma J Martin (1887), Ingle Dove Martin (1889), Nancy Ada Martin (1896), Alice Martin (1897(

Family Finder Participants: No


JOHN D C GUTHRIE
1857AL – Unknown

John Guthrie was born about 1857 in Winston County, Alabama. He was with his parents during the 1860 and 1870 censuses. He is not living with his widowed mother in 1880. She was living with her daughter Della’s family at that time. There is one potential census match for 1880: own Guthrie, a boarder and farm worker living in Ellis County, Texas, who was born in AL about 1857, but I can’t find any other data to rule the record in or out as a match.

HISTORICAL HIGHLIGHTS

1808: BIRTH of EDWIN GUTHRIE
South Carolina, USA on 27 June 1808

Three census records list South Carolina as Edwin’s birthplace.

1815: BIRTH of MARY ELIZABETH CAGLE
Georgia, USA in April of 1815

1830: US CENSUS of GEORGIA
Hall County, Georgia, USA

Edwin Guthrie does not appear as a HOH in Hall County, Georgia until after his marriage to Mary Elizabeth Cagle. There are 2 Guthrie (Guthery and Guttery) households listed for Hall County, Georgia in 1830.

LEROY GUTHRIE HOUSEHOLD:
1 – Male – 50-59 (1771-1780)
1 – Female – 50-59 (1771-1780)
1 – Male – 15-19 (1811-1815)
1 – Female – 20-29 (1801-1810)
9 – Slaves
Total Free White Persons – 4
Total Household Members: 13
Note: Leroy Guthrie is a descendant of GFG2A-Branch K. He lived in GA as s early as 1800 and in Hall County, GA as early as 1820. He died there in 1847.

JOHN GUTTERY
1 – Male 50-59 (1771-1780)
1 – Female 40-49 (1781-1790)
1 – Male 20-29 (1801-1810)
1 – Female 20-29 (1801-1810)
1 – Female 15-19 (1811-1815)
1 – Male 10-14 (1816-1820)
1 – Male 5-9 (1821-1825)
1 – Female 5-9 (1821-1825)
1 – Female under 5 (1826-1830)
Total Household Members: 9 Free White Persons
Note: Although Leroy Guthrie (above) had a brother named John, who also lived in Hall County, GA during the 1820s, he is believed to have moved on to Walker County, AL by the time of the 1830 census. This John Guthrie is currently unidentified. The 1850 census lists him as born in NC with a wife Ginet Gutry.

Edwin Guthrie would be 22 in 1830, so there is a male listed in the above household that matches his age range.

Abt. 1834: MARRIAGE of EDWIN GUTHRIE & MARY ELIZABETH CAGLE
Georgia, USA, probably Hall County

1835: BIRTH of SON – ROBERT LEPEZANT GUTHRIE
Hall County, Georgia, USA in December of 1835

1836: BIRTH of DAUGHTER – E. MILLA GUTHRIE
Hall County, Georgia, USA about 1836

1840: US CENSUS of GEORGIA
Hall County, Georgia, USA

EDWIN GUTTERY HOUSEHOLD:
1 – Male – 30-39 (1801-1810)
1 – Female – 20-29 (1811-1820)
1 – Male – under 5 (1836-1840)
2 – Female – under 5 (1836-1840)
1 in Agriculture
1 over 20 who Cannot Read/Write
Total Household Members: 5 Free White Persons

1841: BIRTH of DAUGHTER – SARAH J GUTHRIE
Hall County, Georgia, USA in May of 1841

1844: BIRTH of SON – WILLIAM EDMOND GUTHRIE
Hall County, Georgia, USA on 7 June 1844

1850: BIRTH of SON – CHARLES B GUTHRIE
Hall County, Georgia or Winston County, Alabama, USA

1850: US CENSUS of GEORGIA
Hall County, Georgia, USA

THE GUTHRIE HOUSEHOLD:
Edwin 44 Tenant SC
E 36 GA
RL 15 GA Laborer
E 14 GA
SJ 11 GA
WE 4 GA

1850: US FEDERAL CENSUS NON-POPULATION SCHEDULES
Hall County, Georgia, USA

E Guthery is listed in the Georgia Agriculture Schedule for 1850. Categories without data were excluded below.

Acres of Improved Land: 20
Acres of Unimproved Land: 230
Cash Value of Farm: 250
Value of Farming Implements and Machinery: 4
Horses: 1
Milk Cows: 2
Sheep: 10
Swines: 9
Value of Livestock: 100
Indian Corn, bushels of: 200
Tobacco, lbs.of: 30
Wool, lbs of: 20
Irish Potatoes, bush. of: 8
Sweet Potatoes, bush. of: 15
Value of Orchard Products in Dollars: 5
Butter, lbs. of: 20
Value of House-made Manufactures: 20
Value of Animals: 41

1855 – BIRTH of DAUGHTER – IDELLA ELIZABETH GUTHRIE
Winston County, Alabama, USA on 5 September 1855

1857: BIRTH of SON – JOHN D C GUTHRIE
Winston County, Alabama, USA

1860: US CENSUS of ALABAMA
Township 12, Range 10, Winston County, Alabama, USA on 14 July 1860

THE GUTRIE HOUSEHOLD:
(Post Office: Eldridge)
Edwin 48 Farmer SC
Elizabeth 39 SC
RL 24 Farmer GA
Milla 21 GA
Sarah 19 GA
William 15 GA
CB 10 GA
JD 3 GA

1866: ALABAMA STATE CENSUS (WHITE POPULATION)
Winston County, Alabama, USA

Edwin Guthrie
1 – Male – 60-70
1 – Male – 10-20
Total Males: 2
1 – Female – 40-50
1 – Female – 20-30
1 – Female – 10-20
Total Females: 3
Total White Population: 5

William Guthrie
1 – Male – 20-30
Total Males: 1
1 – Female – 20-30
Total Females: 1
Total White Population: 2
Note: Listed next to Edwin Guthrie’s Household.

1867: ALABAMA VOTER REGISTRATION LIST
Winston County, Alabama, USA

The Alabama 1867 voter registration records were created as a direct result of a Reconstruction Act passed by the United States Congress on March 23, 1867. The act required the commanding officer in each military district to hold, before September 1, 1867, a registration of all male citizens, 21 years and older, in each county who were also qualified to vote and who had taken the loyalty oath. Each registrant visited the local registration office, took the oath, and was listed in the Voter Registration record.

Return of Qualified Voters (Includes):

Number: 1
Date of Registry: Aug 5 1867
Names of Voters: Guthrie, Edwin
Oath Book # / Page # _ / 1
Color: White
Time of Residence in State: Twelve months
Time of Residence in County: Three months
Time of Residence in Precinct: Ten days

Note 1: The transcription lists his name as Edwin L Guthrie, however the original image lists him as “Guthrie, Edwin” without a middle initial.

A transcription of the 1867 Voting Registration and Loyalty Oaths is found here, which does list Edwin Guthrie’s birthplace as Buncombe County, NC. Since this is not found on the Voter Registration page, it must come from the Loyalty Oath document, of which I have not found an original image.

1870: US CENSUS of ALABAMA
Winston County, Alabama, USA

THE GUTHRIE HOUSEHOLD:
(Post Office: Houston)
Edward 60 Farmer 300RE 200 PE SC
Elizabeth 50 Housekeeper GA
Sarah J 29 GA
Elizabeth 14 GA
John C 18 without employment GA
Alford Tittel 18 without employment AL

1870: US FEDERAL CENSUS NON-POPULATION SCHEDULE
Township 11, Winston County, Alabama, USA
Agriculture Schedule
Note: Categories without data omitted below.

23. GUTHRY, R L
Acres of Improved Land: 10
Acres of Unimproved Land: 70
Present Cash Value of Farm: $100
Present Cash Value of Farming Implements and Machinery: $5
Mules and Asses: 1
Milk Cow: 1
Swine: 23
Value of all Live Stock: $200
Indian Corn, bushels: 100

25. GUTHREY, EDWARD
Acres of Improved Land: 14
Acres of Unimproved Land: 106
Present Cash Value of Farm: $300
Present Cash Value of Farming Implements and Machinery: $10
Milk Cows: 3
Working Oxen: 2
Swine: 25
Value of All Live Stock: $200
Indian Corn: 100 bushels

1875: DEATH of EDWIN GUTHRIE
Winston County, Alabama, USA

1880: US CENSUS of ALABAMA
Winston County, Alabama, USA

THE MARTIN HOUSEHOLD:
Jerrymiah Martin 26 Married Farmer GA GA GA
Idille Martin 20 Wife Married Keeping House GA GA GA
Elizabeth Guthery 60 Mother-in-Law Widowed At Home GA GA GA

1900: US CENSUS of ALABAMA
Black Swamp, Winston, Alabama, USA

THE MARTIN HOUSEHOLD:
Jerry M Martin 44 WM Oct 1855 Marriedx22 GAx3 Farmer
Idilla E Martin 44 WM Sep 1855 Marriedx22 9children 8living GA SC GA
Charley F Martin 18 son MW Nov 1881 single AL GA GA Farm laborer
Wm T Martin 16 son WM Aug 1883 single AL GA GA Farm laborer
Leona Martin 14 daughter WF Aug 1885 single AL GA GA At School
Emma J Martin 12 daughter WF Dec 1887 single AL GA GA At School
Dovie Martin 10 daughter WF Feb 1890 single AL GA GA At School
Joseph C Martin 8 son WM Sep 1891 single AL GA GA
Alice Martin 5 daughter WF Jun 1894 single AL GA GA
Nancy A Martin 3 daughter WF Sep 1896 single AL GA GA
Mary E Guthrie 85 mother-in-law WF Apr 1815 widowed 6children 4 living GA SC SC

After 1900: DEATH of WIFE – MARY ELIZABETH (CAGLE) GUTHRIE
Winston County, Alabama, USA after 1900


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